emag valve + level 10 = bolt stick??

pk5 · 07-24-2008, 02:16 AM

Hi everyone

Last time i asked the question regarding bolt stick, i was able to change the carrier, add 2 shim on my xvalve with level 10 and that solve the problem.

Today i was taking apart that rt-ule mag to add a quick disconnect and make the hose look a bit cleaner so i decide to try the emag valve that i haven't got a chance to try:

The emag valve was bought on here a while ago with a level 10 but no extra parts.

When i put the emag valve on the inteli frame - ule body:

I can feel the pressure of the on/off on the trigger ( this one does not have the ult kit installed), but i cannot get the bolt to fire.

So i tried a bigger size carrier (1 ring 1 dot), add 3 shim, and it still would not fire, then i trim one of the spring to the size of my shortest spring and it still does not fire.

When i insert the carrier to the bolt, i notice that it does not goes down as smooth as the larger carrier on my x valve.

Is this a sign that i should go to a smaller carrier? Anything else i can do to fix this problem? Or is it my sear not reaching far enough for an emag valve.

The sear is currently the one that come stock with the rt-ule.

Thanks

questionful · 07-24-2008, 03:15 AM

Is there a paper-thin (no more, no less) space between the back of the trigger and the sear rod?
Did you try increasing the velocity?
The carrier should be snug but slide freely. In fact it should be the largest carrier that doesn't leak.

Nobody · 07-24-2008, 12:45 PM

also, check your air. i've found that Emag valves don't like anything under 100psi in the tank. that is of course if you have an accurate gauge. so get a fresh fill and test it again. then fiddle with the shims and carriers. i would start at the bottom and work your way up, from nothing, to 1 dot, to line & dot, etc and so forth.

when you don't know, go back to basics.

Clearush · 07-24-2008, 12:55 PM

I would turn the pressure/velocity up first

russc · 07-24-2008, 12:56 PM

Maybe the trigger pin is set wrong.

pk5 · 07-24-2008, 03:28 PM

Ok, so this is my check list to check for later today:

Increase velocity
check sear
check trigger pin
Check on/off

will update the post with the result when i get home from work.

thanks everyone

Clearush · 07-24-2008, 03:51 PM

also which spring are you using, some times the lvl 10 needs to be broken in prior to using one of the longer springs.

pk5 · 07-24-2008, 05:15 PM

I had an extra long spring, so i cut it to equal length to one of the shortest spring as a test yesterday, this is the one i have on the bolt

flyingpootang · 07-26-2008, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pk5

When i put the emag valve on the inteli frame - ule body:
I can feel the pressure of the on/off on the trigger ( this one does not have the ult kit installed), but i cannot get the bolt to fire.

So i tried a bigger size carrier (1 ring 1 dot), add 3 shim, and it still would not fire, then i trim one of the spring to the size of my shortest spring and it still does not fire.

When i insert the carrier to the bolt, i notice that it does not goes down as smooth as the larger carrier on my x valve.

Is this a sign that i should go to a smaller carrier? Anything else i can do to fix this problem? Or is it my sear not reaching far enough for an emag valve.
Thanks

(1) If your trigger feels heavy it means your on/off pin is too long not allowing the dump chamber to fill. The pressure you feel is the bottle pressure pushing down ontop of the on/off pin.
(2) Carrier sizes go up (get looser) in size from blank to 1 dot, to 1 line, to 1 dot & 1 line etc. Use the loosest one that doesn't leak.
(3) Springs: The longer the spring the better the anti-chop capability. You must increase the velocity in order to get the longer springs to fire.
(4) L10 Shims only are used to tune when the bolt vents and resets.
(5) Make sure you have a high output HP sys with more than 850 psi in the bottle. Xvalves don't operate under 800psi.

Your problem lays with #1 with your on/off pin being too long. You can measure it with a caliper from Home Depot. Pin lengths range from about .708 to .765 When you change rails or bodies the thickness vary which is why you need to retune your on/off pin.

alkafluence · 07-26-2008, 06:56 PM

Starting from scratch, put a stock (non-level 10) spring on it, put a 2 or 2.5 carrier and 2 shims in. [Granted, if the 2-2.5 carrier slides way to much it will leak. The objective is to find the smallest carrier that moves freely, but doesn't leak.]

Once you find the carrier that works reliably, you can start tweaking the shims and the springs to get the bolt to reset properly and catch on the sear.

Once you have things generally set, try dry firing about a tank or 2 of air to break things in. Be prepared to move down to the next smaller sized carrier after doing this. You should be set then.

07-24-2008, 02:16 AM	#1 (permalink)
pk5 Active Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 184	emag valve + level 10 = bolt stick?? Hi everyone Last time i asked the question regarding bolt stick, i was able to change the carrier, add 2 shim on my xvalve with level 10 and that solve the problem. Today i was taking apart that rt-ule mag to add a quick disconnect and make the hose look a bit cleaner so i decide to try the emag valve that i haven't got a chance to try: The emag valve was bought on here a while ago with a level 10 but no extra parts. When i put the emag valve on the inteli frame - ule body: I can feel the pressure of the on/off on the trigger ( this one does not have the ult kit installed), but i cannot get the bolt to fire. So i tried a bigger size carrier (1 ring 1 dot), add 3 shim, and it still would not fire, then i trim one of the spring to the size of my shortest spring and it still does not fire. When i insert the carrier to the bolt, i notice that it does not goes down as smooth as the larger carrier on my x valve. Is this a sign that i should go to a smaller carrier? Anything else i can do to fix this problem? Or is it my sear not reaching far enough for an emag valve. The sear is currently the one that come stock with the rt-ule. Thanks

07-24-2008, 12:55 PM	#4 (permalink)
Clearush MCB Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: HTown, TX Posts: 1,506	I would turn the pressure/velocity up first __________________ Carter's Commando Texas division The White Board Comic My SCP Feedback Ebay Feedback MCB Feedback

07-24-2008, 12:56 PM	#5 (permalink)
russc Newbie Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 4,107	Maybe the trigger pin is set wrong. __________________ YouTube Channel / Raincouver! / Gallery / Feedback / Blackleaf Outfitters -Russ

07-24-2008, 03:51 PM	#7 (permalink)
Clearush MCB Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: HTown, TX Posts: 1,506	also which spring are you using, some times the lvl 10 needs to be broken in prior to using one of the longer springs. __________________ Carter's Commando Texas division The White Board Comic My SCP Feedback Ebay Feedback MCB Feedback

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07-24-2008, 03:15 AM	#2 (permalink)
questionful Rec Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 87	Is there a paper-thin (no more, no less) space between the back of the trigger and the sear rod? Did you try increasing the velocity? The carrier should be snug but slide freely. In fact it should be the largest carrier that doesn't leak.

07-24-2008, 12:45 PM	#3 (permalink)
Nobody Active Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 269	also, check your air. i've found that Emag valves don't like anything under 100psi in the tank. that is of course if you have an accurate gauge. so get a fresh fill and test it again. then fiddle with the shims and carriers. i would start at the bottom and work your way up, from nothing, to 1 dot, to line & dot, etc and so forth. when you don't know, go back to basics.

07-24-2008, 03:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
pk5 Active Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 184	Ok, so this is my check list to check for later today: Increase velocity check sear check trigger pin Check on/off will update the post with the result when i get home from work. thanks everyone

07-24-2008, 05:15 PM	#8 (permalink)
pk5 Active Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 184	I had an extra long spring, so i cut it to equal length to one of the shortest spring as a test yesterday, this is the one i have on the bolt

07-26-2008, 06:56 PM	#10 (permalink)
alkafluence MCB Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: The District Outskirts Posts: 65	Starting from scratch, put a stock (non-level 10) spring on it, put a 2 or 2.5 carrier and 2 shims in. [Granted, if the 2-2.5 carrier slides way to much it will leak. The objective is to find the smallest carrier that moves freely, but doesn't leak.] Once you find the carrier that works reliably, you can start tweaking the shims and the springs to get the bolt to reset properly and catch on the sear. Once you have things generally set, try dry firing about a tank or 2 of air to break things in. Be prepared to move down to the next smaller sized carrier after doing this. You should be set then.