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Old 07-04-2012, 05:14 PM   #1 (permalink)
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ICE Epic FPS

Looking for a regulator expert or and ICE Epic owner with similar issues.


Couldn't get a hold of Jim to buy a new Epic so I settled on buying another used one (original one was traded years ago). Though completely operational, this Epic can't shoot over 185fps. It literally looks like I could throw them better lol. When I took the gun apart I took off the two plastic discs screwed on to the back cap (low velocity/indoor kit).

I also pulled out the lower reg assembly and saw two very thin plastic spacers on the top the reg housing. I removed them because they prevent the velocity from being turned up higher. I assembled the marker and though there was an improvement in fps, it wasn't by much. I might be shooting 230. Turning the velocity all the way in doesn't make much difference than when its almost backed all the way out. Nothing else in gun looks weird or out of place and all internals are in good condition.

Assuming the big reg spring has gone bad I decided to get some 10mm washers from the hardware store and put them in the reg housing above spring to put extra tension on the spring itself. This is similar to what you can do in any other reg I've worked on and what you are supposed to do in Ninja Tanks if you want greater output pressure (using factory shims of course).
I tried one shim at a time, each time reassembling the marker and test firing. At 6 shims I had so much trouble putting the asa back on I was worried I might strip the screw threads so I did not attempt 7 shims. With 6 shims, I might be shooting at 260-265fps. My Axe is chrono'd at 285 -292 and the Epic is not shooting anywhere near the distance or fps.

At this point I'm considering raising the output pressure in my tank to Automag rt levels (950 - 1100 output psi) to see if that would help. I'm really nervous about putting more than 850 psi in the Epic though. What do you think the problem could be? I really think its either the lower spring or something in the upper portion of the reg. The manual says a quarter turn on the velocity screw is supposed to change it 20-30 fps but I have not seen that yet.

IF it is that lower reg spring does anybody have an idea of where to get one besides Insight (Jim) because I cannot get in contact with him. I'm sure if I can find the thickness and tension and proper length of that spring I can order one from any pneumatics manufacturer.
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Old 07-04-2012, 06:23 PM   #2 (permalink)
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My Epic had the same issue and one of the places to look is to see if the piston assembly in the main body is put together correctly. There is a brass tophat like piece that has a hole in the side. That hole must face toward the muzzle end, or else the velocity will be terribly low. Think of it like turning an Autococker bolt upside down.

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Old 07-05-2012, 12:44 AM   #3 (permalink)
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My brass top hat piece faces forward and has a very thin orange spacer on it. If i take it off, the gun gushes air down the barrel. I've printed out the manual and I'm going through it step by step. I'm pretty good at figuring stuff out, but this one has me confused
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Old 07-05-2012, 08:49 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Good luck with this problem.
While you're at it, can you figure out why mine won't recock?
Fun gun to shoot, but I just can't solve that issue.
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Old 07-05-2012, 09:37 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Good luck with this problem.
While you're at it, can you figure out why mine won't recock?
Fun gun to shoot, but I just can't solve that issue.
Lol, I can try. Do you have Skype? I could try to help you troubleshoot it, but I need to know what you've tried already. I'm assuming you've already backed out the tiny set screw on the very top of the trigger. I was messing with that yesterday and found that if you screw it in too much the gun won't "recock". Could also be the piston assembly in the brass housing that sits in the trigger frame. Maybe a bad spring or the stainless rod is binding. PM me and I'll see what we can do
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Old 07-06-2012, 08:41 AM   #6 (permalink)
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This is the only part of the gun that didn't match the manual exactly. According to the manual I'm supposed to have the exhaust valve, jet spring, jet, and the exhaust valve oring. I have an additional orange shim that sits on the jet. Note: If the shim is not in place, the gun leaks heavily down the barrel unless I hold the trigger down.


The zoomed in view


I also decided to check the transfer valve but it looks perfectly fine (the oring that sits between the transfer valve plug and the retaining plate is in the tip of the valve plug).


I drained my ninja tank last night and Noticed there were no shims in it so I put two red shims in. I thought there were already shims in it from tinkering with my Automag, but apparently I took them out last time I hit the field with my Axe. I'm getting more air this afternoon, if this whole velocity thing was because my tank output pressure was too low then I will be relieved but I'll still feel dumb As a precaution I took out the 6 shims (washers) I put in the reg spring of the gun

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Old 07-06-2012, 07:23 PM   #7 (permalink)
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She's a screamin' demon!!!

Got gas in the tank and went outside to test with 800-850psi this is what happened:
ICE Epic - YouTube

SUCCESS!

Vid was shot one handed, old paint and velocity just a little too high. After the video I shot the Epic next to my AXE and the Epic is now shooting too hot. I turned down the velocity an 1/8 - 1/4 turn and it shoots beautifully.

I'm not going to discount all the breaking down and relubing of everything, but obviously the tank output pressure was the culprit this time around! I'll just keep my tank pressure here since the Axe's reg can handle it anyway.

I shouldn't have assumed that my shims were in the tank

Anyway I'm up and running now and I can't wait to hit the field with it. Anyone with Epic questions hit me up anytime. I cannot for the life of me contact Jim and there's not near enough information out on the internet on the Epic. I'll be making plenty of videos including a video based user manual.
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Old 07-06-2012, 07:56 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Old 07-08-2012, 06:08 PM   #9 (permalink)
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sometimes the hardest things to figure out have the easiest explanations. at least you have a good idea of what and how an ICE Epic works and how to break it down. glass half full.
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