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Old 01-17-2013, 01:36 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Won't use them on anything other than a pump but they're damn fun to have around. I have some great memories from using them. Armson Prodot or nothing for me.
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Old 01-17-2013, 01:17 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Well, you guys are the masters of 'fun' so I'll defer to your expertise in that department.

But there's a difference between "winning at all costs" and "playing to the best of your ability". You can't control the outcome of a game, but you can control your own decisions.

The sight is symbolic. It tells you "my gun is pointed in the right direction", but there are other ways to arrive at this conclusion, minus the penalties which cannot be named. Red dot sights are the Cliff's Notes version of a book.
If MCBers were still interested in "playing to the best of our ability" all the time, we wouldn't be playing with brass and mechs, we'd be playing with MVPs and space dildos.
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Old 01-17-2013, 01:39 PM   #43 (permalink)
Wait, what?
 
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Originally Posted by GoatBoy View Post
Implicit in the "occluded eye" business is the fact that you need both eyes exposed from your bunker in order to use them, otherwise what you have is "dual occluded eyes", aka blindness. Both eyes pretty much means practically your entire head needs to leave your bunker. This hurts you two ways:

1. Increased exposure.
2. Increased movement time in and out of your bunker.

It is nearly the exact same thing as the hopper/no hopper argument. Your hopper (or whatever part of your body you choose to sacrifice in order to not lead with your hopper) is the first thing out of your bunker, and the last thing to go back in. Except now we're not talking about the blimp on your gun, we're talking about your entire masked noggin.

You're better off familiarizing yourself with your gun and your own body mechanics. Always hold your gun in the same way, aim with your core muscles, and you'll naturally hit anything you're looking at. No-scope.
.....ooooooooor do what you want to do because something that works for one person might not work for another.

I'm left eye dominant and right handed. I find it easier to sight with a point of reference, especially when using something like a brass and wood pirate where the slightest tilt of your wrist will totally change the elevation of the shot. Then again, I'm using a brass and wood pirate so I'm obviously not super-focused on how many g's I can rack up when playing recball. Guess I'm doing it wrong?

One advantage the OEG has over an open dot sight is how easily your eye acquires the dot. It's very easy to lose the dot against daylit backgrounds on a standard dot sight, especially with the CA sun.
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:17 PM   #44 (permalink)
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It's funny because most of my team mates that use some kind of sight find it hard to use OEG sights. My wife and I seem to find it more natural.

Goat Boy is right though, once in a while it does become hard to use when you are trapped behind a tree eeking your marker out as close as possible to the bunker. Thankfully muscle memory kicks in from there for me. I actually train newer players to shoot without a sight first so they build a base muscle memory for snap shooting. Then some of them switch to sights to make those one time shots. Not all of the team need them though and we have a bunch of us that are nasty without sights. One of the guys with a sight just switched back and really like no sight now. I'm glad for him.

It's really preference and play style I think. Slower games make way for sights but fast up in your face games require much more honed reflexes but it all depends on where you play and how you like to play.

On a personal note, I have downgraded to a Tipx now. I have still bee having fun with that although trying to shoot it like a phantom is hard LOL. I just played a game with two Tipx's and that was a nightmare. I'm going back to a single pistol...
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Old 01-18-2013, 03:51 AM   #45 (permalink)
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If MCBers were still interested in "playing to the best of our ability" all the time, we wouldn't be playing with brass and mechs, we'd be playing with MVPs and space dildos.
If that's the benchmark you wish to use, then I agree with you 100%.


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Originally Posted by matteekay View Post
I'm left eye dominant and right handed. I find it easier to sight with a point of reference, especially when using something like a brass and wood pirate where the slightest tilt of your wrist will totally change the elevation of the shot. Then again, I'm using a brass and wood pirate so I'm obviously not super-focused on how many g's I can rack up when playing recball. Guess I'm doing it wrong?
That was part of my point. You have an unstable shooting platform, i.e. it is just plain hard to get a consistent, stable shooting position, so you need a crutch to fix that for you.

Spider's gun with the sight on it -- no stock + pump.

Your pirate -- no stock + pump (?)

808Jackal's phantom in the videos - no stock + pump.

There seems to be a pattern.
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Old 01-18-2013, 05:52 AM   #46 (permalink)
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I used to use an old armson oeg with my custom carter comp and buzzard back in 1989-1990. I felt it had an effective range once I had it zeroed in at a specific distance. I've gotten 1 hit eliminations with it, and I've also missed many shots with it. It was fun for a time.

Try it out for a while if you have the extra money to spend. It's not a waste if it enhances your overall play experience.
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:34 AM   #47 (permalink)
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There seems to be a pattern.
That is where we started, with a PGP.

I admit that most other setups I've tried have not been worth the bulk of the sight, and that's why mine bounced from marker to marker for a while. It was actually useful on a thundercat with a 9oz bottle, but it was not comfortable to use. A thundercat with a small vert bottle...I would probably buy another sight for that setup. They are small and wiggly.

As far as the Cliff Notes thing; when I really needed to know a book well, I would read the book and the Cliff Notes, so I can't argue that.

By the way, you need more fun.
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:29 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Anyone have any experience with the NCStar DDAB Mini Reflex sight?

Amazon.com: NCStar DDAB Tactical Red Dot Mini Reflex Sight - Black: Sports & Outdoors

I am interested in getting one for my Twister Sniper, however, it seems they only come in Weaver rail variants? Anyone know of a similar sight for dovetail rails?

I suppose I could get an adapter: http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Arms-...tail+to+weaver
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:52 AM   #49 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoatBoy View Post
Implicit in the "occluded eye" business is the fact that you need both eyes exposed from your bunker in order to use them, otherwise what you have is "dual occluded eyes", aka blindness. Both eyes pretty much means practically your entire head needs to leave your bunker. This hurts you two ways:

1. Increased exposure.
2. Increased movement time in and out of your bunker.

It is nearly the exact same thing as the hopper/no hopper argument. Your hopper (or whatever part of your body you choose to sacrifice in order to not lead with your hopper) is the first thing out of your bunker, and the last thing to go back in. Except now we're not talking about the blimp on your gun, we're talking about your entire masked noggin.

You're better off familiarizing yourself with your gun and your own body mechanics. Always hold your gun in the same way, aim with your core muscles, and you'll naturally hit anything you're looking at. No-scope.



Need headcam videos of these OEG's in use.
One thing I find funny is that all this discussion of not needing sites for paintball really speaks to one's acceptance of paintball inaccuracy. Because simply put, if you tried to apply that same methodology of aiming to even a 10/22, and hitting a dinner plate at 30yrds, you'd fail miserably.

I routinely hear folks claiming to be able to one-shot a hopper from a diagonal distance across an X-ball field but yet, I've never seen it done, live or on camera.

I invite a video of someone claiming to be 'accurate' without sites to demonstrate hitting paper plate sized at various distances- with single shots from a paintball gun without First Strikes. The distances wouldn't even need to be terribly great- for example, at 100ft, 95% of paintballs shot would fill a circle 28" wide.

I've used red dot sights ever since I got my first paintball gun. That being said, I know it's limitations:
Paintballs must be lobbed therefore most dot sites cannot adjust their point of aim for the extended ranges we deal with in paintball. I found them typically to max out at around 25yds.

You have to account for spread. Some sights with rings can help with this (i.e. if the target's smaller than the ring, don't bother trying to one shot it).

For other distances than what you set, you have to adjust your holdover-under. This is a skill that must be practiced.

All sights introduce a period of 'acquisition time' meaning placing your target in your sights. A good dot sight will have a nearly minimal or nearly non-existant delay if someone's practiced using it.

Using red dots on my previous setups, I frequently found that my first shots against my mirror were closer to hitting than my opponents first shots. Once they had thrown a string at me, then they were setup and good players would then be able to repeatedly snap shoot with some degree of accuracy.

A sight is designed to provide a consistant and repeatable point of aim. Trying to sight to the same exact point on the end of a barrel, with no visual cues is like trying to find the same point on an unmarked cue ball. Trying to sight along the body of the gun may help a little if there are points along the body that are parallel to the axis of the bore, and are cut/shaped in such a way to allow for a repeatable point of aim.
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Old 01-18-2013, 12:46 PM   #50 (permalink)
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A sight is designed to provide a consistant and repeatable point of aim. Trying to sight to the same exact point on the end of a barrel, with no visual cues is like trying to find the same point on an unmarked cue ball. Trying to sight along the body of the gun may help a little if there are points along the body that are parallel to the axis of the bore, and are cut/shaped in such a way to allow for a repeatable point of aim.
I agree with this. I have used a red dot on my marker. A sight's main strength is to help me to consistently and repeatedly place my shots in the same place. For example, I can snapshot through a window at a far distance which requires lobbing.

There are of course downsides to using different sight which you have to get used to and accept. For example, when my red dot runs out of battery midgame, I feel very insecure and my aim is all over the place. Also, using a red dot I have to purposely adjust for shot drop, which feels unnatural to me. Using a ghost ring, I instinctively adjust for shot drop without thinking about it.
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