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Old 11-24-2007, 01:24 PM   #1 (permalink)
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RM Dwell!

So you need dwell adjustment of 45-60 for a RM, I was told.
I have a WAS impulse board lying around which goes from 4-50.
I also have a I-frame for it.

what can be done to reduce dwell time of a RM?

Would a A/C ram help? It would give more ram movement for less air, correct? Making the dwell cap on the WAS board less of a problem, at least in my head it makes sense.

Is there anything else I can do to lower dwell?

I'm going to check out maybe using a I-frame with the WAS board on the Rm. Which would be sick. Eyes and all.

Any comments?
Suggestions?
Stories?
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Old 11-24-2007, 02:49 PM   #2 (permalink)
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i believe the stock dwell on a rainmaker is 45, mine is set to 39. so your was board should work fine as long as it will work the solenoid.

marty mods 1-5, derlin bolt and a new ram will help you to lower dwell. as for a ram get a clippards ram (# SDR-08-1) they are only $14.99 and does not require any modification just the coller from your stock ram.

mine has marty mods, clippards ram, tornado valve and derlin bolt
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Old 11-24-2007, 04:15 PM   #3 (permalink)
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A decent hose kit helps greatly. You want it as short as possible, and make sure you use a QEV for at least the compression cycle.

I tested many, many different comfigurations, and I was able to get the fastest possible dwell with the setup below:


Basically, short unrestrictive hoses.

Also, get an adjustable LPR. The stock LPR is only around 80psi or so. Low enough to pinch, but if thats not important, get a cheap WGP Sledgehammer, and crank it up to 120psi. That greatly improves dwell speed, especially combined with the hose mods.

I was able to lower my dwell to 30ms, for a cycle speed at 18bps. This without any of the Marty Mods. Those are claimed to add an additional 2-4bps, which translates into another 5ms of dwell.

But the hose mod, and lpr mod are practically free, and should be enough

nick
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Old 11-24-2007, 04:48 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Sweet!

I was checking out the I-frame from the Impy, It will fit with a few modifications for mounting. Which means I may just have a WAS'ed RM with vision.

I have a CP HPR and a Jackhammer LPr lying around too.

So all in all it should be awesome.

I need to talk to marty a bit more to see if he's game with this project.

It looks good though.

Thanks guys!
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Old 11-27-2007, 09:56 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Apparently Impulse solenoids run off of 5v unlike the RM's which is closer to 9v.

What other solenoids could be used?

I have the one from the impy but it would be weird to tap it for barbs and such.

Any suggestions?

Should I get a humphrey noid off a timmy?

Seems like the way to go.
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Last edited by RespectTheTeg; 11-27-2007 at 10:25 AM.
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Old 11-27-2007, 10:25 AM   #6 (permalink)
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The Imp solenoid will probobly still work.

Look up the manafacturer specs on airsoldier, or other websites. Most have a large range that they can work at.

The stock RM solenoid was also a 5v unit. Early RMs used 4 AA batteries. Later RMs used a 9V, regulated down.

Plus, nearly all boards made today have some sort of built-in regulation regardless. The guy who made my ThunderboardLCD said you could even run one off a car battery. The board will adjust, and send the correct current to the solenoid.

I'd expect the WAS boards are similar. Jim Drew was an ***, but a very smart one.

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Old 11-27-2007, 10:30 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I tried hooking up the MAC solenoid to the WAS board.
It wouldn't cycle it

The wire gauge is very different. Maybe the WAS board doesn't push enough DC amps to work the noid.

The Impulse solenoid could be the answer then.

The air ports are really tiny though on the impy noid.
Tapping and putting in barbs seems a little crazy.
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Old 11-27-2007, 10:35 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Boards (at least the ones I've seen) typically send unregulated battery voltage to the solenoids or solenoid valves. There's an on-board regulator, but that's only for the microprocessor, eyes, and other stuff.

The current demands of even low-power solenoid valves are too high for the little on-board regulators I've seen on paintball gun boards, so the "firing" transistors switch battery-level voltage to the solenoids.

The solenoids inside solenoid valves (and "pancake" solenoids on electro sear-trippers) are fairly "dumb" and tolerant of voltages in excess of their rating, especially for paintball. If solenoid "on" time (dwell) is 4mS, the solenoid is off for 46mS when firing at 20bps (1/20 = 50mS). That's a really low duty cycle, and gives the solenoid plenty of time to cool off. It's definitely a warranty violation on the solenoid valve, and may burn out the LED that some contain, but it won't harm the important part: the winding that does the actuation.

I wouldn't really worry about running a 5V solenoid valve off a 9V battery, as long as your dwells are so low.


If you have difficulty reliably firing a solenoid valve with a board, the solenoid in the solenoid valve may require a higher peak current than the battery can supply. A "dump" capacitor may need to be added in parallel with the battery, preferably close to the "fire" transistor.

Last edited by MondoMor; 11-27-2007 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 11-27-2007, 10:47 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I was entertaining the idea of using a capacitor or a teeny tiny transformer, the cap is the better choice.

I can't get the WAS board to fire the RM solenoid at all!

No click, no hum, nothing at all.

If i put a 9v on the RM noid it turns on.

If I connect the Impy noid to the WAS board it cycles the noid

For some reason the WAS board won't trigger the RM noid.

I wish I had my multimeter on me to take some readings.

The RM noid is ancient. I would like to get it to work with the WAS board but as of right now using the impy noid or buying a timmy noid seem like the only way it's going to work out.

Does anyone have specs on the MAC solenoid? The impy solenoid's spec are easy to come by. That huge MAC noid is proving more difficult.

Any suggestions?
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Old 11-27-2007, 10:54 AM   #10 (permalink)
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The specs might be buried in here somewhere

When you use the WAS board, are you still using 9V? The poster above implied that it should be passing the current through to the solenoid, so the board should not matter?

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