Custom

[Reedrick]

I have been working on side tapping my Piranha. I cut some clean threads into the body (1/8" NPT) and was very happy with the way the right-angle fitting was looking.

Then-- (SIGH) I attempted to attach this permanently by soldering it into place. I pulled out the big guns. (No wimpy torch here) A full sized oxy-acetalyne rig. I had the flame set up the same as I would use for oxy-acetalyne welding.

Maybe it was the solder I was using (old, thick, unlabeled) but I could not seem to get the solder to penetrate into the threads. Each time I applied, the solder turned into small balls of metal and rolled away.

As I continued to work, the darn direct feed finally pulled right off. (I had the marker hanging from a hook by this) CLUNK!

Well, now I have two jobs and don't know where I am going wrong. Any help appreciated.

[russc]

Well first of all, you don't need an Oxy torch. Propane is probably much easier to control.

I've never had a problem like this...are you applying enough flux to the area?

[joelrf600r]

sounds like you have a contaminated surface. a couple of questions:

did you clean all oil off of the mating surfaces prior to soldering?
is the right angle brass or steel?
did you use flux tu clean and prep the surface?


as a side note, if you set your oxy-acet to a neutral flame like you would for welding, there's a good chance you'll wind up applying enough heat to vaporize the flux, and soften and distort the brass. better to go to a brazing flame and reduce the heat a bit.

--J

[Reedrick]

This is a big help already.

Well, in all honesty-- I wasn't planning to do the solder job while I was in the shop. After seeing how nicely the elbow fit I nearly grabbed the teflon tape, but saw the torch sitting there and a spool of solder and figured that I may as well make a permanent bond.

-NO FLUX was used at all (I must confess this crime openly!)
-The solder was really thick and old
-My torch was hard to gauge- but it was probably somewhere between brazing and oxy-weld setup.

I'll give it another go soon with less heat and FLUX. Any suggestions on solder type?

[kidneythief]

Solder does'nt "go bad" so the old solder does'nt mean anything.

Make sure the elbow you are using is also made of brass...because you wont beable to get dis-similiar metals to bond using regular solder.

Also, solder wont draw into the joint like its supposed to unless you use the proper flux. Ive done plenty of solder work without cleaning the joint before hand because most flux cleans it for you...not to mention the heat will burn away any oils that are left.

Lastly, make sure you are heating the joint enough to physically melt the solder....this is where welding and soldering/brazing differ. Dont melt the solder with the actuall flame, heat the metal and flow the solder with the flame.

-Jake

[Reedrick]

The help is much appreciated.

I'm discovering there are many dangers along the way in doing "simple" mods like this one. (At least when you are inexperienced as I am!) At least the strong desire is there to learn...

1- I plan to solder the elbow first, then reattach the direct feed. The elbow I have is brass- so it should work!

2- This time, I've got flux! Will be sure to clean and prep carefully.

Going back to the shop tomorrow. I'll post pictures if it works out, otherwise I'll pretend that some "other fool" ruined the gun...

Do I need to plug the barrel (was thinking aluminum foil) to keep solder from entering the feed port? I think I got a few "flakes" in there last time that made the bolt a bit rough. (Probably have to work these out before reassembly)

[Schmitti]

No need to plug the barrel. As long as you only feed it enough solder to fille the joint you should be okay..... this is where paying attention really is important! If you heat the joint, add solder and take the heat away.... if you continue to heat you will get solder all over.

Practice with some copper pipe first. This will help. I promise!

E

[Jaan]

My boss is a master solderer and I just watched him solder a gun back together for PW Paintball and I learned a few things. You know now how important cleaning the surface with flux is. We also had problems keeping the direct feed on since we were re-soldering the entire body back together...next time try wrapping a wet rag around the direct feed to cool it down and prevent it from getting hot enough to separate.

I really wish I had video taped him doing the job. It's great seeing someone with 40 years experience doing something.

[kidneythief]

You should'nt have any issues with solder entering through the feed port...there should'nt be that much solder anywhere on the gun. Keep in mind that a very very light amount of solder is strong enough when applied properly.

-Jake

[Emerald Wolf]

A couple of things to add to KT's sounds advice.

1. ) You don't have to polish everything smooth, a little tooth helps the solder hold.

2. ) Heat the thicker piece first. (in this case the elbow) Put the flame on the tube from time to time.

3. ) Touch the solder to the joint opposite from the flame (never heat the solder directly, it'll just melt and roll off), Keep touching the solder to the joint until it melts. Usually then you can take the torch away and finish running the solder around the joint.

4. ) I'd do the gas elbow first, then the feed neck. The elbow is a pretty thick assembly, so it'll be a bit more heat tolerant than the feed neck. The feed neck being thinner it won't take much heat to get it stuck...(the wet rag heat sink trick works, be sure not to set the rag on fire

Good luck...Just take your time and it'll turn out fine...

Catchya on the Flip Side.....

Emerald Wolf -- make sure your flux is good for brass. Most are...but it doesn't hurt to check....(I did a PGP out of steel, and had a bit of trouble finding the right flux)