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Old 12-27-2010, 12:54 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by cjottawa View Post
Not to rain on the parade but, having used a Q-Loader on several markers, I would NOT recommend them, not for regular paint, not for First Strike rounds. They're more trouble than they're worth.
Qloaders are definitely only as good as the operator. If you can't follow instructions, then qloaders are not for you.

Meanwhile, this is pretty much the only way you're going to fit a (un)reasonable amount of first strike rounds onto your gun. Without adding a drum or belt feed.

Now... In exchange for the steep learning curve that qloaders have... You can now carry 80 first strike rounds in a compact package. And feed them at 30+bps.

Is that more trouble than it's worth? Maybe. But you've gotta hope that you don't run against the guy who decided it wasn't.


Pricing to be determined. It will be a function of how many I'm selling. To recoup the cost of development. I mentioned in another thread that that part had a 17 hour run time....

EDIT: Flint, the fins only get hung up when feeding the reverse of what's pictured.
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Old 12-27-2010, 01:29 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Perhaps a mild expansion of the dial holes might fix that issue?
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Old 12-27-2010, 01:36 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Great Idea Alpha434! I don't know if it'll work in the long run but, it's the kind of thinking the PB community needs.

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Originally Posted by cjottawa View Post
Not to rain on the parade but, having used a Q-Loader on several markers, I would NOT recommend them, not for regular paint, not for First Strike rounds. They're more trouble than they're worth.
I think I see where you're coming from (My Qloader in five years has gone from marker to marker, before finally settling on a direct feed SP-1 mount), but I wouldn't go so far to dismiss this idea just yet. Most of the problems with Qloaders stem from the inherent flexiblity of Paintballs. Beyond that, quality control of Qloader parts, and fragile CM socket material, are the next big problems. Personally, I have 12 pods, only one of which has a failed part. in all of them, I've had to replace the drive shaft bumper o-rings (where the nut threads on) as they get squished over time. I've also shot over 1K of FS rounds so, I know them pretty well.

Somethings to consider:

- Do not allow for any gap in feeding, at the beginning of a pod, or during (i.e. preload stack before engaging every pod). FS rounds are more rigid so, you won't have warping or dimpling but, they are more brittle so they will break from breech impact much easier.

- If you do a feed 'tube', make sure it's rigid. Any impact from a PB to a FS will fracture the FS and will likely jam the path (due to the fragment shapes and their rigidity).

- Direct feed allows for lower pre-winds if you're feeding downward.

- Ensure that the feed length absolutely cannot change. With PBs, they can flex a little bit to account for an odd ball stack length. FS rounds will not give and may lock a partially shot pod in place unless the length is perfect.
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Unfortunately all of you have played the one "speedball" game of paintball for so long you can't conceive of other ways to do this and hence any new ideas seem stupid.
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Old 12-27-2010, 01:44 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Perhaps a mild expansion of the dial holes might fix that issue?

Maybe. You're going to find out when you're beta testing.



I do think that a direct mount is ideal when both feeding paintballs or first strike. Adding a flexible link is always asking for trouble, in my experience.

But you guys will figure out how to make it work the way you want it to, I'm sure.
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Old 12-27-2010, 02:13 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by alpha434 View Post
Maybe. You're going to find out when you're beta testing.



I do think that a direct mount is ideal when both feeding paintballs or first strike. Adding a flexible link is always asking for trouble, in my experience.

But you guys will figure out how to make it work the way you want it to, I'm sure.
Oh im doing a direct feed for sure, it just the direction of the FS round that concerns me, it gotta go the other way so i can fit it on a bottom fed.


I did some testing with a regular drive helix, and the single FS round i have, and i think i understand what causing the blockage:
The round doesnt sit stable, and twists, since it sits on the round portion rather than the flat fins. So the fix would be possibly an expansion of the dial (though there isnt much to expand there, its pretty thin already...) or grooving the helix shelf?

Since im beta testing, do i get a free helix? or at a greatly reduced price, with free updates and expansions in future?
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Old 12-27-2010, 02:40 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Naw. I have to sell the beta products to cover the first stage of r&d. That way I'm not out of pocket for 3 or 4 stages of development before we have a refined product.

With the new auger, the problem isn't that the round isn't stable. It's that it has to find a hole. Being a man of your stature, Flint. You know how hard that can be. Especially with a square leading edge.

I imagine that a lot of the problems can be fixed with a combination of jb weld, sandpaper, and the desire to make it work.

Although... I definitely want to mount a loader nose first also. That way I can get my face close enough to a small gun to see down the sites.
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:25 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by alpha434 View Post
Naw. I have to sell the beta products to cover the first stage of r&d. That way I'm not out of pocket for 3 or 4 stages of development before we have a refined product.

With the new auger, the problem isn't that the round isn't stable. It's that it has to find a hole. Being a man of your stature, Flint. You know how hard that can be. Especially with a square leading edge.

I imagine that a lot of the problems can be fixed with a combination of jb weld, sandpaper, and the desire to make it work.

Although... I definitely want to mount a loader nose first also. That way I can get my face close enough to a small gun to see down the sites.
There is a pun there, but i cant find it
I keep thinking whether it would an of the 6 holes, into 2 or 3 slots, might be a solution - that way the pressure fins would still apply, and the space for fitting the round would be greately expanded.

Need to find some broken dials, to test this.... or a cheap replacement...
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Old 12-27-2010, 03:57 PM   #18 (permalink)
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... i cant find it
Damn. You're good!

Slots... That was one possibility that I was thinking of. Or chamfering all the holes. Or even making a new phone dial with some really serious chamfers. Anything to help the FS rounds locate, ya know?
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Old 12-27-2010, 04:29 PM   #19 (permalink)
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@alpha - great job! How are you 'printing' them, rather what rapid prototyping process are you using?
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Old 12-27-2010, 04:33 PM   #20 (permalink)
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MLA.

Only the first prototype will be done this way. The betas will be cast.
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