The Dead Zone Paintball Related Chat

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Old 11-08-2011, 12:38 AM   #51 (permalink)
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I like the way my local field does it. It is a courtesy not a rule. They would like you to offer it to kids and the like, but the refs flat out tell you if they are playing don't bother surrendering them, they won't surrender and it's not required that you accept it. However, if you don't be prepared for the consequences and don't complain afterwards about getting shot at close range.
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Old 11-08-2011, 11:22 AM   #52 (permalink)
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unless im literally right behind another player - as in, i could touch them with my barrel - or its just a young scared pre-teen, i just go ahead and shoot them once. its just too iffy as to whether an opponent is gonna turn around and start blasting me wildly. i can shoot once in a controlled fashion so as to cause minimum pain, or they turn and shoot me a half dozen times in random places like my throat and crotch.
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Old 11-08-2011, 01:47 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by NSGSplatmaster View Post
A keen referee should pick up on this and eliminate players accordingly, but this is difficult in the heat of the moment. I have seen just as many arguments over surrender rules as I have when people actually bunker each other; if anything, these arguments are compounded by a lack of understanding by both players, or the referee, or everyone involved. From a "skill" sense, no one really likes going up to someone, extending them a courtesy, and then getting a ball to the throat from point blank for their efforts. Obviously, local demographics apply; a field with a more experienced level of play or an older audience should not feel as inclined to enforce certain aspects of surrender rules as one that frequently gets younger players.
I'm not actually arguing against any of this. Not right now anyways.

Originally Posted by NSGSplatmaster View Post
I think a few posters, through the desire to sound e-badass or through genuine opinion, may be a bit misguided on how best to approach recball scenarios. At the risk of sounding crass, if you're really ready to juice and be juiced, a tournament is the appropriate place to graduate into.
I'm not talking about "tournament juice". Strange that tournament play has to be brought up as some sort of example when this entire thread, this entire time, has been about rec play.

It's an interesting argument though if I turn it around on you. If most of your time has been spent in big-boy tournament play (or any other format that lacks the rule) then you're simply not accustomed to rec-play rules. That includes surrendering people. I.e. you have not had enough practice with the surrender rule.

If we're going to diverge, then it should be on this major point.

Does it take a significant amount of skill to properly, and safely, surrender players?

Does it even make sense to put a rule in place which literally requires something of him that, by definition of placing such a rule in effect, he can't possibly have?

I like surrendering players myself (I think it's funny, plus I'm ultra cheap when it comes to paint), but I don't think it should be the rule. But so long as it has been the rule, I have followed it and learned to use it correctly.

Nothing about tournament play or tinkleball. Just learn and follow the rules.

As a ref (you said you were a ref right?), I'd think that you would appreciate that. Very weird.
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Old 11-08-2011, 03:45 PM   #54 (permalink)
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I want to state that first off I can't say I completely agree with the way in which the video went down. Attempting to surrender an entire room is generally (note I said generally) not going to work. However, there are situations in which it is appropriate. I don't think this time in the video was overly a great decision but I also can see the OP's point of view. The OP seems to play at a field were the number of inexperienced players is probably the majority and thus in that situation a surrender attempt is worth the attempt. This situation seems to simply be that there were more semi-experienced players in this bunker and obviously the tactical advantage was not there for the OP.

In short, OP didn't have tactical advantage but due to generally having large numbers of inexperienced players made some assumptions that they would surrender. This didn't turn out as well for him as he would have liked I am sure, but that is not necessarily something he did wrong to the opposing players but more a failure on his part in tactics. Good on you for looking out for the inexperienced/young players!! Sucks when you try to do that and it doesn't turn out quite as well as you would hope.

As for my opinions on the surrender rule. I personally think it is a great thing, our local field views it as courtesy and it works well for those that use it. My issue with surrender doesn't fall within the surrender rules themselves at our field but more the "I am the baddest of them all" ego riding guys (usually fairly experienced but still kids/teens) that tend to be out there that don't want to use it and instead lay into a young or inexperienced player. The surrender rule is there in particular to protect those types of players, if you are an experienced player it is very easy to pick out those that are and aren't experienced....thus you should be able to determine very easily when you should/shouldn't use the surrender rule...good judgement is sadly often lacking. If your argument is that this inexperienced player may not surrender then that is something you as an experienced player should be willing/able to handle. You are familiar with taking hits at close range...he/she is not...give them the option, inexperienced players are the future of the sport, give them a good experience. Mind you I am not saying let them turn on you...if they don't take the surrender then that was their decision and I say take the shot, but an inexperienced player taking a close range hit unexpectedly from behind is often going to give them a bad taste for the sport and the sportsmanship in it. There are enough idiots out the better player.

Last edited by Hamstring; 11-08-2011 at 03:49 PM.
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Old 11-08-2011, 04:02 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Yea, when it comes to the surrender rule, it doesnt always work on inexperienced players. Especially if they get surprised.
The last time i tried it, it was on a ~10-12 year old and the only way to get him out would be to mercy or point blank him(which ididnt want to do). He was sitting down back against the wall next to a door and window inside a building. I ninja'd around and got within touching distance and shouted 'MERCY MERCY MERCY!'. He freaked and let a round that zipped just past my head.
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Old 11-08-2011, 04:06 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by -=ArchAngel=- View Post
I ninja'd around and got within touching distance and shouted 'MERCY MERCY MERCY!'.
You wish to surrender to me? very well then, I accept.

Yelling "mercy" is a horrible way to attempt to eliminate a player.

If you've got the drop on someone you firmly tell them "Take the hit!"
If they make any move other than to call themselves out then you go to trigger on them.
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Old 11-08-2011, 04:14 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ScrapIron View Post
You wish to surrender to me? very well then, I accept.

Yelling "mercy" is a horrible way to attempt to eliminate a player.

If you've got the drop on someone you firmly tell them "Take the hit!"
If they make any move other than to call themselves out then you go to trigger on them.
Yea. In retrospect, that wasnt the best way to do it.
I paid for it a few seconds tho when another person on the otherside of the building heard me, came through another door and shot me in the *** lol.
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Old 11-08-2011, 04:17 PM   #58 (permalink)
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I am amused by all the different things people yell instead of "surrender."

Surrender rules cause more fights than they avoid. Both on the field and on the interwebs

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Lets show them the MCB way of playing this game. We'll show up late, miss the first game or two, talk about and fondle each others markers, have lunch, talk about where we will play next, play a game or two, and go home complaining how tired we are after playing all day. Should be a lot of fun.
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he doesn't manage a business, and he should have planned it out better or had some experience in what he was doing before taking pre-orders. the worst part is simply that he took the money and did not refund it... which is fraud.

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Old 11-08-2011, 04:25 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Yeah, "Mercy" is the word at my local field and it often leads to confusion with new players despite a "training video" - I yelled mercy at some kids in a tunnel and they yelled it back...because they thought it meant "I give up" -_-

Requiring players to offer mercy also sucks because I usually get "mercy" in turn or shot because you are supposed to yell and it totally gives you away (especially in "town" or "building" settings).
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Old 11-08-2011, 04:25 PM   #60 (permalink)
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fun thread at first - now it seems tired and personal.
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