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Old 03-28-2012, 11:43 AM   #1 (permalink)
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A Milsim Question.

I have been feeling the milsim itch a little more over the last few weeks, but it is creating quite an interesting dilemma.

I HATE the ergonomics of the M-4/M-16/AR-15. Can’t stand it. I don’t know exactly why, but it has always just rubbed me the wrong way.

Thus, I am studying to be a gunsmith and weapons historian with an "Eastern Block" specialty.

My question is: Why are there no faithful representations of Kalashnikov (AK's, Saigas, etc) or Simonov (SKS, PTRS, etc) family rifles for milsim players? There are a million-and-one interpretations of Stoner's brainchild, but not more than 2 or 3 paintball equivalents to the most popular assault weapons in the world?

Plus, let’s face it, we all love wood stocks here!

Any reasonable ideas as to why this has occurred?

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Old 03-28-2012, 11:51 AM   #2 (permalink)
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^This^ is about the only reason I can think of. AK-47's and anything based off then are evil and bad. So says the media.
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Old 03-28-2012, 11:57 AM   #3 (permalink)
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^ bang on.

There is a great book called "AK 47: the peoples gun" Which details the history of the gun.

In today's 'western' society, the AK 47 now represents the gun of the terrorist, the ganster, drug dealer or of the oppressive military. Its not very popular.

Fantastic weapon yes, but it has PR problems...

Add to that, the design is old. Brilliant but still old. And everyone wants the shiny new kit they see in MW3! 'New = better right??'
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Old 03-28-2012, 12:10 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Not sure I agree with the lack of availability of AK47 types. Tacamo makes full kits for several of the Tippmanns including wood stocks. I think they even make a full on AK47 repro based on their own design. IIRC Rap4 does as well, but I always question their quality. Havent kept up with it, but Tippmann used to offer AK47 styled stocks, magazines and foregrips for the 98, A5 and X7. Spec Ops or Opsgear, used to offer some parts as well. Always seemed fairly even to me. Obviously, US Army paintball isnt going to offer an AK variant since that would be sort of contrary to their mission. Let's face it though, most people want to be GI Joe though, not Hesbollah.
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Old 03-28-2012, 12:41 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I was more referencing full-build markers, not kits. The tacamo stuff is okay, but the fact of the matter they are ungodly heavy.

I just cannot understand what exactly what factor makes one assault rifle "evil" and another acceptable. Yet, the Saiga, which is a direct decendant of the AK's liniage, is considered socially normal in the US now? (It would also make a dandy base for a paintball marker as the 12ga version could be 1/1 scale...)

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Old 03-28-2012, 01:24 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconic Muffinman View Post
I was more referencing full-build markers, not kits. The tacamo stuff is okay, but the fact of the matter they are ungodly heavy.

I just cannot understand what exactly what factor makes one assault rifle "evil" and another acceptable. Yet, the Saiga, which is a direct decendant of the AK's liniage, is considered socially normal in the US now? (It would also make a dandy base for a paintball marker as the 12ga version could be 1/1 scale...)
Tell that to Connecticut. The 7.62x39 saiga is still banned, or was until recently, or people thought it was at least.

I don't think the lack of milsim AKs is entirely because AKs are "evil terrorist guns". There aren't many paintball guns styled after other weapons to begin with. The issue is that milsim just isn't the single dominating force in paintball so companies only make whats most popular. You can get almost any style airsoft gun you want because airsoft is milsim by default. One of the reason tippmanns are so popular is that they can be styled in a number of ways by the user. Manufacturers make more money with less risk if they just produce a base gun and let players customize it to their liking.
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:25 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconic Muffinman View Post
The tacamo stuff is okay, but the fact of the matter they are ungodly heavy.
A real kalash isn't exactly light either. They weight almost 12 pounds loaded (for comparison, an M4 weighs 6.9 pounds loaded). You want realism, right?
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:51 PM   #8 (permalink)
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There are a few markers that look like AK-47s. One is pretty cheap (tacamo?), another is other end - Engler.

Engler Paintball Guns

for an SKS, automag rifles do pretty well.

One big problem I see is that you tend to pay as much for a good AK-looking marker as you would a real AK. If you are a big fan, you might as well buy a real one. Otherwise, you are paying for a relatively expensive imitation of an inexpensive firearm.
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Old 03-28-2012, 02:12 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
A real kalash isn't exactly light either. They weight almost 12 pounds loaded (for comparison, an M4 weighs 6.9 pounds loaded). You want realism, right?
My Warsensor WG-47 weighed close to 20lbs loaded with a tank. Thats 2 AK's.

I understand that many milsim markers arent modeled directly after firearms counterparts, but there are several that blatently use real firearm features or components, like HK sights on A5's, or the more recent FN aditions to the X7. The BT series of markers has several copies of real firearms, and DP's new marker is fairly convincing as well. The SP8, and MK-X8 were also deliberate copies of the HK XM-8 prototype.

Im just curious as to why older, less space-age designs have been, for the most part, overlooked by major manufacturers.

Quote:
I don't think the lack of milsim AKs is entirely because AKs are "evil terrorist guns". There aren't many paintball guns styled after other weapons to begin with. The issue is that milsim just isn't the single dominating force in paintball so companies only make whats most popular. You can get almost any style airsoft gun you want because airsoft is milsim by default. One of the reason tippmanns are so popular is that they can be styled in a number of ways by the user. Manufacturers make more money with less risk if they just produce a base gun and let players customize it to their liking.
I have a feeling it mostly comes down to this. There simply arent enough people with my personal preferences I presume, which is curious to me, given the popularity of the real firearm and its wide range of variations. That, or maybe the design simply hasnt been given the correct widespread popularity in video games played by young players..
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Old 03-28-2012, 03:45 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I think it also comes down to the fact that paintball is mearly a luxury game. If your goin to pay all that money for a toy you may as well buy some super wiz bang future tacticool gun than a simple AK.

Real world I would take the AK in a heart beat over the M16
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