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Old 09-07-2012, 02:20 AM   #131 (permalink)
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I now realize I'm completely out of touch with what's normal in paintball south of the border.
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:32 AM   #132 (permalink)
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HI RUSS! HOW YA DOIN'?

The guy in the video certainly isn't my way either. But he's not pumping paint any worse than the others I see in that video. And I'm going to make a mad assumption here and guess that the guys on the other side are letting fly at around the same rate of fire.

We're simply going to see this same machine gun mentality as long as ramping markers, and for that matter any solenoid fired marker, are allowed out onto woodsball fields.

Marking up the field paint to crazy cost values is certainly one way to control it but another is limited paint. But then the field operator cuts down their profit so we're simply not going to see this happen.

Looking at the video it sure makes me appreciate the pump only days we get out this way.....

It also reminds me of way back when I thought that I should have ONE ramping marker. I bought something that I simply don't recall the name of at the moment and a force feed hopper. The "great day" came when I got to try it out. I shot two hoppers of paint through it at an old car that was on the field. I giggled like a schoolgirl at the end of it in wonderment and and sold the gun to one of the guys watching that thought it was Uber Kool.

Now I'm simply another old curmudgeon like Russ that says we should all "just say no" to batteries....
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Old 09-07-2012, 02:46 AM   #133 (permalink)
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There should be a licenceing system for high rates of fire. Something where you can prove you can control yourself with the fire power. Then because you have proved you can control the fire power, some type of penalty system can be installed for over shooting. It's all wishful thinking... I just wish any d***head with too much money wasn't able to get the latest and greatest high end with almost zero knowledge or control.
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Old 09-07-2012, 03:04 AM   #134 (permalink)
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Bruce! Good to see you on here! I haven't played much this summer due to a sprain, but I did make it out to WCPW!

I tend to have the same relationship with my electros...I buy them because they're cool from a mechanical standpoint and then sell them without actually playing with them.
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Old 09-07-2012, 04:55 AM   #135 (permalink)
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Just watched the entire video.

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I now realize I'm completely out of touch with what's normal in paintball south of the border.
That's just foolish.

Are you confusing "not being bothered by" and "normal"?

It is not "normal", particularly for "rec" play (which this kind of isn't) to shoot that much paint.

I don't really want to get too heavy into tactics, but the simple point is: he is not overshooting *people*.

As long as he isn't overshooting people (and there is every indication that he is not.overshooting.people), he is free to overshoot bunkers, trees, dead space, rocks, grass, all he wants, if he wants.

If you want to cite a border difference, that might be a better way of putting it.

Again, he's communicating and coordinating with his team, calling his guys off in order to let the dead players out (something I very, very, rarely see other players doing, not just in this video, but anywhere, ever -- and this is the kind of thing you notice when you do it yourself), giving some extra paint to another player... He's playing with his dad, which I think is great. Other members who have played with this guy have no complaints.

So really, does the sheer paint volume, which is the only thing you can point at, literally overshadow everything else?
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Old 09-07-2012, 09:14 AM   #136 (permalink)
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This looks like a big game
Scenario plays are the worst for this kinda stuff
Driving the paint cost up will drive away players I think. All of em
I'd quit playing if paint was more than 60 a case and I'm a pump player
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Old 09-07-2012, 09:17 AM   #137 (permalink)
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Just watched the entire video.



That's just foolish.

Are you confusing "not being bothered by" and "normal"?

It is not "normal", particularly for "rec" play (which this kind of isn't) to shoot that much paint.

I don't really want to get too heavy into tactics, but the simple point is: he is not overshooting *people*.

As long as he isn't overshooting people (and there is every indication that he is not.overshooting.people), he is free to overshoot bunkers, trees, dead space, rocks, grass, all he wants, if he wants.

If you want to cite a border difference, that might be a better way of putting it.

Again, he's communicating and coordinating with his team, calling his guys off in order to let the dead players out (something I very, very, rarely see other players doing, not just in this video, but anywhere, ever -- and this is the kind of thing you notice when you do it yourself), giving some extra paint to another player... He's playing with his dad, which I think is great. Other members who have played with this guy have no complaints.

So really, does the sheer paint volume, which is the only thing you can point at, literally overshadow everything else?
Actually it does for me, yeah. It's why I don't go to the large scenario games. Even up here north of the border, when the fields have their larger scenario games, they purposely reduce the paint prices from their normal higher prices. Naturally, that attracts many of those who want to shoot high volumes of paint. Now you have a high volume of people on the field, many of whom go to these events precisely because they can "let loose" and shoot lots of paint. So yeah, for me it is the sheer paint volume that keeps me away.
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Old 09-07-2012, 09:21 AM   #138 (permalink)
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I think this is where people get confused. It is also possible that I am just so far out of the loop that I am off.

When I play speedball I expect to see, to some degree, a high volume of paint in the air. I expect more if I have signed up for a tournament and I expect a generally more aggressive style of play. Rec speedball should have less paint and less aggressive play but I still expect to see a relatively high volume of paint and relatively high volume of aggressive play compared to larger fields.

I never really saw the difference between a big game and a scenario as far as individual play went with the exception of possible a rubber stamped "leader" and possible missions. I understand if I go play a massive scenario there is simply going to be more paint in the air because of the amount of players.

However, I do not expect to see a single player putting that much paint in the air or a group using that aggressive of "clearing" techniques.

Perhaps its just a fault in my perception. Perhaps its a fault in producers not being clear enough on what to expect. Without clearly laid out expectations one really cannot fault the player for running to the edge of the rules as they are written.
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Old 09-07-2012, 10:07 AM   #139 (permalink)
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After reading most of this, and watching some "informative" videos, I think I need to comment.

1: WOW! That guy uses a LOT of paint!

2: There is, I think, such a thing as overshooting cover fire. 5 bps seems to have about the same effect as 30 in this regard. But if he wants to really shoot, let him shoot - as long as he's not lighting up people (which he apparently does not do -- and in this vid I never saw him hit anyone at all...).

3: He brought his dad along - that's actually pretty cool.

4: At the beginning of the video I found myself thinking "You guys camp much?" I would just walk away from this main group anyway and play my own style.

5: Shirtless? Really? WHY?

So maybe this guy is a pretty good player, but we all know there are really bad players who think they are great because they hose paint.

These guys don't play as I play - and that's fine. I take a hopper on the field (just one). I play pump or mech-semi (I don't do Electros because I would rather play "Rolex" than "Casio" any day).

I would support a field that had an "OVER 18 ONLY" policy (on some days, or on some fields) because I'm pretty tired of being shot a dozen times by a kid with a wizz-bang gun. I am SO over hearing kids whine about getting shot. OF course, I would also support a field that had "Under 18" days/fields (so they don't have to listen to us old dudes whine).
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Last edited by ironnerd88; 09-08-2012 at 09:25 PM.
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Old 09-07-2012, 10:50 AM   #140 (permalink)
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Awesome than its agreed. My other in to is you could have land features that normally you wouldn't causr your afraid of kids getting hurt
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