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Old 12-19-2012, 10:26 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Are FS as bio-degradable as regular paintballs yet? If not, then there will always be resistance from some fields to allow them. Some fields do think about the environment instead of just the almighty dollar.
They are supposed to break down by the sun, but people have mixed results because it supposedly takes quite a while.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:06 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I think the hugest problem is the average paintball player doesn't have the equipment that will take FS rounds. Same with .50 cal paint, it takes conversion kits, or a new gun, or new loaders if you want to use them. It's just cheaper to buy regular paint and go out and play a few more weekends than it would be to spend so much on new stuff only to play again after you've acquired everything.
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Old 12-19-2012, 12:01 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Biodegradability- I've not ever heard a single field owner cite that as the reason they won't allow them.

Manufacturing, none of the marker manufacturers make the rounds. They're made by Perfect Circle, and the manufacturing process is also under patent. If there was enough demand, then they could dedicate a production line to them and this would reduce the price somewhat but, never to the cost of regular paint.

Price: Why make them cheaper? They are plenty cheap enough for those willing to take the time to learn their trajectories, and use tactics that take advantage of their higher accuracy and range. I've been shooting nearly nothing but FS rounds for over two years now and I still pay less using them, and I'm getting more eliminations per day.

Tactics (since I brought it up): To keep your cost/elimination ratio up, you must change your tactics / habits. Get out of the habit of getting in close, snapshooting, shooting through cover for an elimination, and suppressive fire. Short story of how I realized this:

I first played with FS rounds for a half day at my local woodsball field. In that period, over multiple (about 4) games, I got 24 eliminations and I used 40 rounds, I played somewhat conservatively because I hadn't used them before in a game. I went back the next weekend, and I got my butt handed to me 3/4 of the day until I realized that I was playing just like I did with a normal paintball gun (getting in close, trying to work angles, snapshooting), except I was now using a mag fed system, while my opponents, were shooting nearly hoppers for every mag I shot. Once I realized this, I did better on that day, and I've gotten better since.
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Originally Posted by Tom Kaye -in response to FS price critics
Unfortunately all of you have played the one "speedball" game of paintball for so long you can't conceive of other ways to do this and hence any new ideas seem stupid.
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Old 12-19-2012, 12:16 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Ban fist strike. Everybody wins. Field paint for life.
Please show us a single field where fist strikes are allowed? Not only are they unsafe, it's illegal.



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Old 12-19-2012, 12:17 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Biodegradability- I've not ever heard a single field owner cite that as the reason they won't allow them.
I'll make it official then...now you have.

I think when and if FS become more popular, that issue will become a bigger issue. On any given day at our field (and any other field), there are the remnants of thousands and thousands of paintballs lying around from previous play. If FS were to become so popular that they were the norm in paintball, I could only imagine what the field would look like with the number of non degraded shells multiplied 100's or even 1,000's of times. It's not a big issue now, but the discussion is about getting FS more popular. If that happens, it then becomes a huge issue.
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Old 12-19-2012, 12:26 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
I'll make it official then...now you have.

I think when and if FS become more popular, that issue will become a bigger issue. On any given day at our field (and any other field), there are the remnants of thousands and thousands of paintballs lying around from previous play. If FS were to become so popular that they were the norm in paintball, I could only imagine what the field would look like with the number of non degraded shells multiplied 100's or even 1,000's of times. It's not a big issue now, but the discussion is about getting FS more popular. If that happens, it then becomes a huge issue.
Fair enough. Which is another reason why I would argue that we don't need folks shooting them like they currently shoot paintballs.

When I specifically asked field owners to allow them, I brought up the biodegradability (and how long they could be expected to break down) and, they brought up 10rd tubes and 12grams that are still lying around from the early days. But, like you, they probably were thinking that the volume wouldn't be all that high (given the price).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Kaye -in response to FS price critics
Unfortunately all of you have played the one "speedball" game of paintball for so long you can't conceive of other ways to do this and hence any new ideas seem stupid.
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Old 12-19-2012, 01:26 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Most airsoft BBs aren't biodegradable. They end up just getting mulched into the dirt.
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Old 12-19-2012, 03:14 PM   #28 (permalink)
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I don't really want to see First Strikes become too popular. Right now they offer the trade-off of volume for range and accuracy. When everyone has them, we'll be playing the same game as today at longer ranges. Only it'll be 20 or 30 cents a shot, or whatever. If the full-auto DAM becomes the norm, I doubt I'll keep playing. Sure, that's been said of every tech advancement, but I can't be paying two or three hundred per case at Matrix speeds.

...anybody wanna go play hopper ball?
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Old 12-19-2012, 03:22 PM   #29 (permalink)
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I don't really want to see First Strikes become too popular. Right now they offer the trade-off of volume for range and accuracy. When everyone has them, we'll be playing the same game as today at longer ranges. Only it'll be 20 or 30 cents a shot, or whatever.
But it wouldn't be the same game. Now accuracy by volume is commonplace. At 20 or 30 cents per shot, accuracy by volume becomes almost extinct. So it would be a totally different game.

However, should FS become so popular to replace regular paintballs and the price drops as well, close to what is now paid for regular paintballs, then your point may become valid.
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Old 12-19-2012, 03:39 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Define affordable?

If FS price drops to regular paint prices, you realize that the same people that shoot ropes, will start shooting ropes of FS, because the means to that will be provided quickly enough.
THIS x1000.if people start shooting ropes of fs rounds than we are right back where we started which is stagnate bboring drawn out fire fights.
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