Paintball

[Horizon]

I don’t watch Mike’s videos (except for the couple that have been linked to here on MCB). It’s not that I don’t use profanity or am even offended by it. Heck, I’ve worked construction most of my life and have cursed with the best of them. I do understand that there is a large segment of our population that doesn’t believe a production is real unless it uses profanity. They think anything without profanity must be produced by church going tea-totallers. So be it. I’m not sure why that is, but some people think that if you are not cursing, you are not being real. Fair enough. In today’s age of anything goes, no one is going to be able to control that, even if they wanted to. I do know, that if I catch my 10 year old watching one of Mike’s videos (or any other similar video), he won’t have access to the internet for a while. It will be a tough punishment for him (and for me), but that’s what parenting is all about. Making the tough choices to teach your kids that being civil in our society is important. Knowing when and where to curse, and when not to, is important. Having instructional videos on the internet where anyone can view them, is not appropriate, at least in my opinion. The demoralization of our society doesn’t have to be (and is not) supported by everyone. Sure we can choose not to view it (as I do), but there are many impressionable minds out there, that will be subjected to it.

Someone said (I believe jokingly) that Mike will change when his twins are born. I don’t know if that is true. I doubt that it is. I think Mike likes the notoriety. I do know that I already have kids, as do thousands of other parents with kids interested in paintball. We already need to deal with it now, before Mike matures.

[stevedavidson]

Originally Posted by Horizon

I'm not sure what the lobbing thing means, but I guess I can do that.

I agree with much of what you posted that is currently missing in our industry and would be beneficial to have at this point (or earlier in our history). Some of it is quite tournament base, which admittedly I have little interest in (but I know you do). I’m just not sure how having Youtube around earlier and having guys like Mike spouting off would have helped in achieving these goals.

For instance, how is Mike helping in accomplish:
a place for parents to get real information about the game
decent industry assistance for youth and school-based playing programs
a community values program that stresses respect for the game rather than gangsta

I would like to see those things in place as well, but I don’t think people like Mike are helping in the least in accomplishing those tasks.

I've got no dog in this fight. I'm happily house-husbanding and writing fiction these days, doing my science fiction blog (crotchetyoldfan) and my link aggregation page (the classic science fiction channel). I do enjoy watching the trainwreck that is paintball and feel that I have a 'right' to inject commentary on it whenever/whereever I feel I ought to as someone who was heavily involved for 25 years. My "theme" if you will is still pushing for the things that need to change in order for paintball to be doing things "the right way"

"lobbing" as in 'softball question' - meaning that it was easy to provide an answer to.

I was not specifically referring to Mike being on youtube. What I was referring to was Mike's consistent call for doing away with BS and addressing the real issues in paintball.

For example: the ASTM, which established a paintball subcommittee, was initially an important and valuable association for the industry. Its now pretty much gutted politically, because powerful and influential companies decided that following the safety recommendations was against their monetary interest. The primary value of ASTM was a backup for the industry in the event of major court battles. An operator or manufacturer would be able to say "I followed the ASTM guidelines" and could use it as a fairly strong defense.

No longer. Ignoring and undercutting things like ASTM increases insurance costs, liability exposure, etc. (meaning it just ends up costing the player more).

Mike has been attacking the mindset that says "we're bad, we're paintball, we're self-regulated, who cares what we do, we'll just shout you down if you rock our boat" - and this is needed in my opinion.

The people who want to ignore the things that need/should be done by attacking the messenger, throwing money at it, character assassinating, buying people off need to be exposed for what they are and for what they are doing BEFORE any meaningful change has any chance of happening.

Mike may be a foul-mouthed SOB in person and on video, but right now, that's about all "the kids" hear. He has obviously gotten their attention and wouldn't have if he didn't play down to their level to some degree or other.

The sad truth is that this is politics and no matter what your initial intentions were, you always end up in the mud.

I think that Mike is accomplishing some good - at the very least there is an alternative voice out there.

And so far as focusing on tournaments goes - go back and re-read: universal rules apply to woodsball/scenario and stock as well, as do player ID systems, as do safety concerns.

[stevedavidson]

on the language thing:

I'm totally of the same opinion regarding words as has been articulated by social commentators like Lenny Bruce, George Carlin and Lewis Black.

There is no such thing as 'bad language'.

Using those words regularly robs them of much of their impact. Sticking them in a special category only empowers them more.

I was watching Black last nite and here's the example he gave: 'without words like **** how does an adult express real anger, frustration, etc?

He said 'take someone who just lost their job, their salary, their benefits. there they are sitting at home on the couch, head in hands. what do they say? 'oh *****willow!? sassafras! sassafras! sasafrass!'

[punkncat]

I am sure that I will not say this as eloquently as I like...

But what part does cussing play in any of the great speeches, or essays in history?

Can you imagine if Abe had come out in his reading of the Emancipation Proclaimation and throw a cuss word in every few moments?
How much of an impact would Martin Luther had with a potty mouth?

Now granted, paintball and the examples I have given are a whole world apart and I nor anyone else can deny that. But the point I am trying to make is that in order to get across with a message that would even be considered to have valid points and an intelligent point of view is going to require the tact and foresight to consider the vocabulary involved.
Lots of people upon hearing a cuss word no longer even consider the intent of the person talking, and no longer take them seriously. Such language only suitable for degenerates and simpletons.

The fact that cussing has become so commonplace notwithstanding, it certainly does not make a point any better simply for using foul language.

[incynr8]

Oratory is the art of enchanting the soul, not comparing it to an orifice.

[Furby]

You know...I wouldn't mind someone attempting to buy me off...

[idkfa]

Originally Posted by stevedavidson

I'm totally of the same opinion regarding words as has been articulated by social commentators like Lenny Bruce, George Carlin and Lewis Black.

I think the issue is that techpb not only provides paintball commentary, but alleged how to and instructional videos. This sort of language has no place in these sort of videos, especially when they are geared at conveying information to younger players.

[Horizon]

Originally Posted by idkfa

I think the issue is that techpb not only provides paintball commentary, but alleged how to and instructional videos. This sort of language has no place in these sort of videos, especially when they are geared at conveying information to younger players.

Exactly. This isn't about cursing or not cursing. This is about cursing in the appropriate environment. You wouldn't make kindergarten videos, cursing throughout, just because cursing is common in our society today.

I love George Carlin, RIP, but even he wouldn't do his usual act in front of an Elementary or Jr. High sSchool crowd. He knew when to control himself.

[c6quad]

his cursing doesn't bother me but i can sorta see why some don't like to hear it too. i also feel that if a kid is too young to be hearing foul language, he/she is too young to be playing paintball or trying to work on his own equipment which could lead to a serious accident.