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Old 04-08-2014, 02:14 AM   #11 (permalink)
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The H7 was pretty accurate as a pump. Then I autocockered (jack-hammered) it. Now it's less accurate. As a pump with the .683 Lapco barrel I was getting out to 75 yards more/less accurately. Now I'm only able to hit reliably at 50 yards with confidence. So I've set in the scope for 50 yards and I just aim down the barrel for anything closer but since it's a closed bolt FS cocker, I'm like, what the hell, might as well use it. But the friggen 468 with a palmer reg and .686 HH was shooting circles around the cockered H7. It's ridiculous how accurate the damn 468 is now, especially since it's just a damn stacked tubed spyder. Kinda pissn me off considering how much effort I put into the stupid closed bolt semi autoed H7. LOL.
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Old 04-08-2014, 10:24 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Would you consider the pump version of your hammer 7 to be on par with the 468?
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Old 04-08-2014, 12:00 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Scottallen, can you post a pic of how the reg is mounted on the 468? I was tentative about a 468 due to the internals being so similar to a spyder. I have a parapro now that is great but if the 468 can achieve similar results I may recommend it for people looking to save money.
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Old 04-08-2014, 06:21 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I used a palmer inline reg after I bottomlined it. Did this by using epoxy putty inside the hollow handle and putting on the ASA rail's bolts into the epoxy with some nuts on it. So in theory the nuts will stay in place because of the epoxy putty but the bolts should be able to be removed. I could have just screwed an ON/OFF adapter to the back of the inline reg and then the tank, or just skipped the ON/OFF and just the tank and it still could have had the stock on it, but I found I liked the tank drop better.

Accuracy wise, I'd say the H7 was OK before but I've had a really hard time hitting stuff with my first shot with it. That's why I haven't bought a SAR12 yet and why I'm trying to get them to start making me one now. They JUST came out with their semi-auto kit for it. I'll miss with the first and hit the second. With pumps or bolt action, I mess up my sight picture with the pumping/bolt action. Not so much the left/right but the up/down. I usually drop it either just in front or just behind my target. So it was pretty good, but I just can't seem to do pumps with FS. I was OK with the Trracer, which is actually much better than the H7, but I had to make my own mag with it. It was also crazy quiet by comparison.

I'm glad your parapro is working. I sold off mine to a pb store buddy of mine. He can fix anything. I had issue after issue with mine. Got most of them resolved but I found I just wan't getting the kind of accuracy that I had come to expect with it. Which is too bad because it was great marker ergonomically and visually speaking. Like couldn't hit a 2' target at 50 yards and catastrophically chopped/jammed FS about 6% of the time locking the bolt forward and leaking all the air out of the gun down the barrel. He's got it working better now but after the second time, I was like "NOPE, DONE, BUYING A LOCK BOLT". I hope Rap4 leases the lock-bolt to other guns because it's awesome. Everything else of their is sketchy from what I've heard but damn if this 468 ain't impressive so far.
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Old 04-08-2014, 06:26 PM   #15 (permalink)
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The M17 from Milsig might be a good option for a semi automatic FS rifle.
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Old 04-08-2014, 06:55 PM   #16 (permalink)
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The M17 from Milsig might be a good option for a semi automatic FS rifle.
That and the mythical T15.....
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Old 04-11-2014, 12:13 PM   #17 (permalink)
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In so far as the markers, I do think that there might be some difference between platforms (for the moment ignoring my concerns about the smoothbore presection). When I had the high FPS camera I did some slow-mo of the barrel in the MR5 during firing. I did it because FS are so accurate/long range that barrel harmonics might actually start to matter as a contributing factor to accuracy and I wanted to see if the barrel experienced any flex during firing. It definitly showed some flex. Not exactly like an AK but still noticable.
I been slackin! High Speed Barrel Flex here. Gear and ammo is en-route. The trouble shooting confirmation test is tentatively scheduled for next Thursday or Friday.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:43 PM   #18 (permalink)
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News on the trouble shooting front. I ran a test last Wednesday, and eliminating the smoothbore presection helped accuracy (or it could be that closed bolts are naturally more accurate, but this seems less likely). The problem remains that we're still no where near the right level of accuracy even after getting a very minor boost from artificially centering three groups of eight. At this point I think I might just have a bum HH barrel. Before running out of the door for a game in Tampa this weekend, I looked down the barrel and saw what appeared to be slight hill in the bore. Similar to what you might expect the negative side of a ding to look like. There wasnt a a corresponding ding on the outside of the barrel though. Once I'm back in jax, Ill take another look to confirm, but I'm fairly certain there was slight bump in the bore (a manufacturing error maybe?) and that it might be whats frustrating my accuracy.

In related news, I also tested centrifuged rounds. Turns out that they are more accurate than plain jane rounds. My impact plot data for that test was messed up, so I dont have hard standard deviations, but what I do have is the ability to compare downfield chrono sweetspots.

Edit: I also fixed my chrono problems. If you recall, I suspected that the light source I used was washing out the chrono's ability to detect peripheral passes. I bought some rope light and stretched them across the plastic light diffuser that sits above the eyes, and got much better sensitivity.

Basically there is a trapezoid area above each eye of the chrono, that a round has to pass through in order to properly register at that eye. The machine counts the amount of time that passes between each register and calculates the speed from that. If the round goes through the chrono but is outside both of these areas, then you wont get a read (referred to later as a 'no-read'). If it passes through the first trapezoid, but not the other, then you get an 'error' reading. In the plain jane test, I got several 'no-reads' and one or 'two errors'. This means that a lot of rounds were so wild that the chrono was essentially blind to them, and at least a couple that were less wild but still bad enough the the chrono had no idea how fast they were going. The centrifuged rounds, had one 'error' reading and no 'no-reads'. No hard vector based standard deviation, but still more accurate.

Edit: For the sake of completeness, the data was recorded but it was very rushed and I’m not confident that I didnt switch some of the positive/negative signs in my haste. I caught myself doing it once or twice and needless to say, this is something that can inflate the final standard deviation. I’ve added this third run to the previous spreadsheet.

Last edited by Whiskey Hammer; 09-23-2014 at 02:15 PM.
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Old 05-14-2014, 02:34 PM   #19 (permalink)
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The culprit:







I usually check bores from the chamber end and this bore defect is small enough that you’d only ever notice it if you were holding the barrel at the right angle to a bright light source while looking down the muzzle. Something I dont do as a matter of habit, and something I only did as a matter of expediency. It sits very close to the muzzle of the barrel and is probably not doing my accuracy any good. I’ve emailed Hammerhead, so hopefully well be able to get it switched out and tested soon.

Last edited by Whiskey Hammer; 09-23-2014 at 02:13 PM.
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Old 05-14-2014, 04:13 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Huh. I would have never noticed that on one of my barrels. Just cursed the day away at what a bum shot I was. Good eye.
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