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Old 03-12-2013, 06:56 PM   #1691 (permalink)
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Right, and he may be dead by the end of this season because he is a threat to Rick who has killed others that pose a threat him. Like Shane and the guys in the bar.
tyrese was a threat too, morgan as well, as was merle, even michonne and later on andrea. rick doesn't kill every possible threat, and rick is still alive. you seem to just selectively choose rick's actions to support your idea that eliminating every possible threat is the way to go, but rick as a whole doesn't follow that method.

the problem is simply you using that method to support the governor when he obviously has taken it to the extreme. the national guard at the time was not a threat. they are capable, but not hostile. there's nothing wrong with eliminating threat, but there is more than one way to eliminate it. rick has done so with morgan the 2nd time they met. the problems with governor is he sees only 1 way to deal with a threat, and that he sees anything close to being able to match him in strength as a threat. even things that wouldn't be considered a threat by others, he would see it as a threat. like i said, that's paranoia. rick's the one with leadership.

Last edited by heinous; 03-12-2013 at 07:00 PM.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:00 PM   #1692 (permalink)
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I wonder if anyone from the show has read any of this thread. I just re-read the entire thread. This is amazing. Despite the flaws we seem to find, we still are "hooked" on the show.

I haven't read the comics, but I know someone who does. From what he tells me, the comics are very "adult".
Take the "Governor" for instance. I guess that in the comics story he's even a child moletser, and was known for messing with "Penny", his own daughter.

The writers need to "sanitize" some of the story as it just can't be put on basic cable. Sure, we see Lori's infidelity, Andrea's loose morals, Glenn and Maggie's bumpin' uglies here and there. Excellent gore and "splatter" shots, heads being lopped off, plenty of "four-letter Anglo-Saxons" with the exception of the F-Bomb and the C-Bomb.

I'm certain that the censors have a field day going through some of the script. It's gotta be difficult to write, and re-write and keep the continuity and the story flowing. They're doing a pretty bang-up job if you ask me. I'm still watching and waiting for next weeks episode.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:01 PM   #1693 (permalink)
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I wonder if anyone from the show has read any of this thread. I just re-read the entire thread. This is amazing. Despite the flaws we seem to find, we still are "hooked" on the show.
this thread is a bunch of americans idolizing a bunch of brits acting as 'murikans.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:11 PM   #1694 (permalink)
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tyrese was a threat too, morgan as well, as was merle, even michonne and later on andrea. rick doesn't kill every possible threat, and rick is still alive. you seem to just selectively choose rick's actions to support your idea that eliminating every possible threat is the way to go, but rick as a whole doesn't follow that method.

the problem is simply you using that method to support the governor when he obviously has taken it to the extreme. the national guard at the time was not a threat. they are capable, but not hostile. there's nothing wrong with eliminating threat, but there is more than one way to eliminate it. rick has done so with morgan the 2nd time they met. the problems with governor is he sees only 1 way to deal with a threat, and that he sees anything close to being able to match him in strength as a threat. even things that wouldn't be considered a threat by others, he would see it as a threat. like i said, that's paranoia. rick's the one with leadership.
You really seem hung up on the killing of the soldiers. Sorry, but I simply see it as making a decision to eliminate a very real possible threat. The governor didnt kill Tyrese and his band did he? No, he accepted them in to their fold. Because they were not a group of assault rifle carrying commandos. They were not perceived as a threat to his power or people. Do you think if the Governor would have approached the soldiers and told them that they could join their group if they hand over their weapons that they would have? Maybe. Or maybe they would at that point be warned and on the defensive. Why give your opponent or threat the ability to respond and get yourself or people that have proven themselves as loyal to you killed? Why give up the element of surprise? So because he used deception to win in a game with no rules, he's inherently evil? I disagree. Again, I'm not saying he isn't a bad guy, some of his other actions have proven he's a nut. But IMO the issue with the soldiers isn't grounds for villifying him.
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Old 03-12-2013, 07:24 PM   #1695 (permalink)
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You really seem hung up on the killing of the soldiers. Sorry, but I simply see it as making a decision to eliminate a very real possible threat. The governor didnt kill Tyrese and his band did he? No, he accepted them in to their fold. Because they were not a group of assault rifle carrying commandos.
i consider 3 types of encounters as far as this argument goes. threat, possible threat, and harmless. i brought tyrese up as a possible threat because he is a possible threat to rick. he isn't to the governor: the governor's army massively outnumber tyrese's team. the difference in population makes this argument only work one way.

i believe your original argument is that the governor is right in killing any possible threat, but remember that the governor actively seeked out the national guard to kill them. they wouldn't even be aware of woodbery, iirc they were just going to stay put and wait for the (down unknown to them) helicopter to come back. governor already proved he had capable scouts when he mentioned knowing rick went back to town to get supplies. why not put that scout to good use? he could have monitored the completely unaware national guard team to see if they are actually hostile. in fact, he should already suspect the national guards are friendly after having met the helicopter pilot who divulged everything. instead he simply killed them in cold blood. he had other safe options than to kill them without checking them out. he was just lazy. he did have an element of surprise like you said, and he could have used it to do many things, but he used it to kill instead.

and add this to the mix: if the attack was so justified, why did he have to hide it??

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Old 03-12-2013, 07:59 PM   #1696 (permalink)
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Guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Going to have to watch these episodes again, but did the pilot say anything about where they came from? Seems interesting that almost 3 years after the outbreak that a group of soldiers still have a helicopter with fuel. Is this an indication that somewhere there is still a semblance of civilization?
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:02 PM   #1697 (permalink)
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Guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
BUT WHAT WILL ENTERTAIN BENJI NOW

i think the chopper guy told the governor their location. when he got there the governor did have a small chat using the white flag before just killing all of them.
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Old 03-12-2013, 09:46 PM   #1698 (permalink)
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I don't view the Guardsmen as "threats".
Having been in the Canadian National Guard ( Militia) and the US Air Force, and working with US Air National Guardsmen, I feel that they would have followed the "Governour's" orders and been compliant.
I think that they would have contested the Guv's leadership less than a lawyer or business man living in Woodbury.

I don't mean to offend Guardsmen , but they're mechanics, carpenters, students etc that like to paint their faces, drive the Jeep and shoot the gun one weekend a month.
Not hardcore, not trained killers.
I actually got the impression that the pilot was glad to have found civilization and hopefully have lunch provided.
He did not assert his "Officer"ness and try to take charge of jack.

I was in for 4 yrs and spent time in the Middle East during Desert Shield/ Desert Storm.
I shot a M16 twice. Once during Basic Training ( .22 cal coversion) and once in Germany during Security Police Augmentee training ( .556) and that was one time more than many of my senior NCOs. We were not provided weapons overseas.
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Old 03-12-2013, 10:23 PM   #1699 (permalink)
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Please don't jack this thread with facts.
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Old 03-12-2013, 11:22 PM   #1700 (permalink)
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Wow, a guy goes to take a final and the thread goes wild. It was too much to read.
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