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Old 03-26-2014, 09:07 AM   #2951 (permalink)
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But Heinous they would have had to do the same thing.

"Hey Phil, enjoying your nap"

then later

"Phil saw him"

Sorry it sounds stupid to ask "hey phil you remember his face"

The non-verbal recognition of the guy trying to call out to his friend who was choking him out that there was someone under the bed was all the clues you needed. We did not even need to know Phil's name. He could have simply said "one of the guys got a good look at him" and we would have known who it was.

Besides what you have missed is that the reason for the re-telling of the story to Daryl is not to generate the link between Phil and Rick. But to let you know the motivation behind Joe and his crew. It is not a simple issue of survival, but revenge. They are not just going about their business and writing off the loss of one of their own as an accident or them wandering into someone else's house. They see everything as "claimed" that they run across and even though someone was in the house before they were, they "claimed" it. Thus Rick killed one of their own...attacked them.

So now they are out looking for that one person. To exact retribution. They don't care to help Daryl out in finding a girl. Yeah these "heathens" who we are given the impression would "claim" a woman without any hesitation if they wandered across her, are more set on finding out who killed one of their own than to find a piece of tail.

Here is prediction for you on the situation. I think you are going to see stories develop more and longer from this season out. The first two seasons of most shows tend to be more shallow as they simply do not know if they are going to draw an audience so they lure people in with the simple stuff...the hooks. Don't develop deep stories as you have no idea if you are going to make it to season 2, or even season 3. It is 3rd-4th year that shows tend to change and take on more depth and go from there.

It is the pivotal 5-6th seasons that come into play and they either do great and have a good following to last 10-11 years or they start to die out as the writers run out of ideas and new writers completely alter the characters and directions the fan base have had.

The unique an interesting thing here is Kirkman is involved in the show and still actively developing even the comic story line. Something that has not been experienced before in TV. So it could be very interesting as long as other Hollywood drama does not come into play...actors starting to demand incredibly high salaries, writers guild strikes, etc,etc, etc.
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Old 03-26-2014, 01:14 PM   #2952 (permalink)
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why do we care about the name of the guy who saw rick's face? the point is that one of joe's gang saw rick's face. the point was easily discernible. I don't think it's much of a concern knowing or not knowing who phil is.
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Old 03-26-2014, 01:51 PM   #2953 (permalink)
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Agreed...his name was just that a name. It made sense in the realm of the conversation, the name added nothing to the story.
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Old 03-26-2014, 03:14 PM   #2954 (permalink)
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But Heinous they would have had to do the same thing.

"Hey Phil, enjoying your nap"

then later

"Phil saw him"

Sorry it sounds stupid to ask "hey phil you remember his face"

The non-verbal recognition of the guy trying to call out to his friend who was choking him out that there was someone under the bed was all the clues you needed. We did not even need to know Phil's name. He could have simply said "one of the guys got a good look at him" and we would have known who it was.

Besides what you have missed is that the reason for the re-telling of the story to Daryl is not to generate the link between Phil and Rick. But to let you know the motivation behind Joe and his crew. It is not a simple issue of survival, but revenge. They are not just going about their business and writing off the loss of one of their own as an accident or them wandering into someone else's house. They see everything as "claimed" that they run across and even though someone was in the house before they were, they "claimed" it. Thus Rick killed one of their own...attacked them.

So now they are out looking for that one person. To exact retribution. They don't care to help Daryl out in finding a girl. Yeah these "heathens" who we are given the impression would "claim" a woman without any hesitation if they wandered across her, are more set on finding out who killed one of their own than to find a piece of tail.

Here is prediction for you on the situation. I think you are going to see stories develop more and longer from this season out. The first two seasons of most shows tend to be more shallow as they simply do not know if they are going to draw an audience so they lure people in with the simple stuff...the hooks. Don't develop deep stories as you have no idea if you are going to make it to season 2, or even season 3. It is 3rd-4th year that shows tend to change and take on more depth and go from there.

It is the pivotal 5-6th seasons that come into play and they either do great and have a good following to last 10-11 years or they start to die out as the writers run out of ideas and new writers completely alter the characters and directions the fan base have had.

The unique an interesting thing here is Kirkman is involved in the show and still actively developing even the comic story line. Something that has not been experienced before in TV. So it could be very interesting as long as other Hollywood drama does not come into play...actors starting to demand incredibly high salaries, writers guild strikes, etc,etc, etc.
it only sounds stupid because you are bad at writing a script.

"do you know what he looks like?"

"still remember his face, phil?"

"i hate the bastard too much to forget."

"yep, we do."


it even adds to the "to exact retribution" cause that you have stated. it shows they are emotionally invested in the cause, instead of just being told so. that took 2 minutes to write. the show's writers had way more time than that.

and yes, he could have simply said "one of the guys got a good look at him" and we would have known who it was. under your logic we could have skipped the whole house episode and just hear the whole story through joe's retelling, then reveal at the end that it was rick. but again, you are falling to the "we know the story, it doesn't matter how well it is told" pitfall, which doesn't work because the hallmark of a good show is not whether it did or did not tell a story, but how well the story is told.

and even if phil's name isn't important for now, you never know how the story will unfold later. case in point, martinez added nothing to the story until much, much later, and they gave him a name very early on.

hell, shupert added absolutely nothing to the story at all and he had a name. how can you think the only person in this whole group who is the key witness, is not already important enough to warrant a memorable name?

if you're going to focus on a group for any length of time, it is beneficial to add names.
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Old 03-26-2014, 04:25 PM   #2955 (permalink)
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Endless nitpicking is boring. I find the show entertaining.
I really enjoy the whole end of the world survival aspect of the show.Drama is drama.
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Old 03-26-2014, 04:28 PM   #2956 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by TooningSpork View Post
why do we care about the name of the guy who saw rick's face? the point is that one of joe's gang saw rick's face. the point was easily discernible. I don't think it's much of a concern knowing or not knowing who phil is.
it was set up that way. so people have something to talk about. also fact get people think on how did know rick too.
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:09 PM   #2957 (permalink)
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Sorry H.

But but why would Daryl have asked "do you know what he looks like?"

He wouldn't because he has no vested interest to know. No suspicion that it was a friend or anything like that. The information had to be presented from the gang's perspective not elicited from a question. So the passing comment that Phil got a look at his face is a more realistic presentation of getting the information out there.

Nor does your line of questioning provide motivation for the group. That is already set by them mentioning that they are hunting down the person who killed a "friend" and left him as a walker trap. There again is no reason for Daryl to ask a question as to "did you see who it was" sort of things. That makes no sense whatsover given the context and the characters as they have been developed.

Now if that was Rick...Rick being a former police officer would have asked the question "did you get a good look at him" or something similar. Not Daryl.

And not certain how you think my logic would have come up with that. A terrible analysis on your part. Because if you think the logic is that then why not just skip to the end.

And I agree that we do not know what the importance of things currently are. Never said otherwise. What I said is that we did not need to know Phil's name. "need" is past tense and in the context of the conversation was limited to what we were talking about. Of course that could change. That is the sign of good writing to be able to make things that are normally not important something of importance. Knowing the name of a character helps humanize the character, we saw that with Lizzy actually giving names to the walkers. She was humanizing them mentally. She was nuts...but that is what naming them does.
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:15 PM   #2958 (permalink)
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I think Daryl wanted to know what he looked like because he wants to find the rest of his original group. Just if it was anyone from the prison.
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:27 PM   #2959 (permalink)
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remember, Daryl was an undercover cop
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Old 03-27-2014, 02:16 PM   #2960 (permalink)
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remember, Daryl was an undercover cop


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