mcarterbrown.com  

General Chat MCB's Coffee House: Pull up a seat, and grab your favorite caffeinated beverage. Non-paintball related chat within.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 12-17-2012, 05:52 PM   #121 (permalink)
Wookie D*ck
 
russc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flint View Post
Watched it today, Imax 3d HFR. It was awesome. 48fps was awesome. Finally no more ghosting, bleed and other junk that is due 24fps.

Hopefully more movies will be in HFR.



Them are fighting words
You do realise that you just made all editors and vfx artists, your sworn enemies?
I'm firmly against HFR. Those TVs that interpolate footage and boost it to 60fps are garbage for anything besides watching sports, and this isn't much different.

I read a theory somewhere that it's sort of like the uncanny valley effect, where it is just real enough to be distracting, and that draws attention to its fakeness. 24fps, even 30fps are fine. 60fps looks like cheap camcorder/live action, and things start to look good again around the 100/120fps mark.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by agentSmith View Post
oldschool play is about sportsmanship and respect, oldschool gear is available on Ebay.
russc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 06:08 PM   #122 (permalink)
Post Whore
 
Flint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Toronto

Quote:
Originally Posted by russc View Post
I'm firmly against HFR. Those TVs that interpolate footage and boost it to 60fps are garbage for anything besides watching sports, and this isn't much different.

I read a theory somewhere that it's sort of like the uncanny valley effect, where it is just real enough to be distracting, and that draws attention to its fakeness. 24fps, even 30fps are fine. 60fps looks like cheap camcorder/live action, and things start to look good again around the 100/120fps mark.
Most cameras that supposedly shoot 60fps are actually doing the same interpolating as the TVs. But im not sure why are you comparing interpolated 30fps, to a true 48fps footage? Id be even happier to see 100/120fps as a standard, but we arent there yet.

IMHO what is happening here, is that you aint seeing what im seeing, and i aint seeing what you are seeing. lol.

Last edited by Flint; 12-17-2012 at 06:12 PM.
Flint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 06:11 PM   #123 (permalink)
Wookie D*ck
 
russc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC

The interpolation isn't what makes it look "too real," video game cutscenes have the exact same issue and those are true 40-60+ fps. It's just a matter of being too fast, which allows us to see that it's staged rather than having our mind fill in the blanks.

HFR is great for reproducing life as we see it, but that isn't the point of a fantasy movie.

[edit] I understand why it's being pushed, though. Tightly shot action scenes don't display well at 24fps. That's always been a peeve of mine when I get a bad seat and have to sit too close. An ideal solution IMO would be to use lower framerate shooting for most scenes, and ramp up to 48+ during action sequences. Just let the editors control where they bring in the variable framerates.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by agentSmith View Post
oldschool play is about sportsmanship and respect, oldschool gear is available on Ebay.

Last edited by russc; 12-17-2012 at 06:18 PM.
russc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 06:37 PM   #124 (permalink)
Post Whore
 
Flint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Toronto

IMHO you are allowing preconceived notions to color your impression of "non standard" framerate. Keep in mind that the 24 frames was a number picked up fairly arbitrary, and not for some cinematic values. For example, classic silent movies, do you watch them in original framerate, or in the modern framerates? (essentially sped up.) I know that i didnt watch them in original framerate, until i was an adult, and frankly i had a hard time, getting rid of the feeling, that the movie should run faster...
Flint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:13 PM   #125 (permalink)
Wookie D*ck
 
russc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC

All I know is that I prefer 24 and 30 fps to 48 and 60.

There are plenty of downloadable examples out there:

http://wemusic.veenue.com/libraries/...electric_0.mp4 (right click save as)

There are plenty of people out there who agree with me, too.

Quote:
"There is no honest discussion that can be had about this Hobbit footage without emphasizing the 48fps presentation. The film was shot this way and will be digitally projected this way, as well as presented in 3D. So what does 48fps movie footage look like as opposed to your usual 24fps theatrical movie experience? In this reporter's opinion, it looks like live television or hi-def video. And it didn't look particularly good. Yes, this is shocking, but I was actually let down by the Hobbit footage, as were a number of the other journalists that I spoke with afterward...

While 48fps may create a more realistic, "you are there" picture quality, it actually works against The Hobbit from the 10 minutes of footage we saw. This undeniable "reality" kept pulling me out of the movie rather than immersing me fully into its world as the Lord of the Rings films did; the very fantasy element, the artifice of it all (whether it's the wigs, fake beards or CG monsters) was plainly, at times painfully, evident. There was none of the painterly gentleness that film offers a fantasy film, as was so beautifully the case with the original (shot on film) LOTR trilogy...

I didn't go into CinemaCon expecting to write anything less than great things about The Hobbit, but the very aesthetic chosen by Peter Jackson has made me very nervous about this film. It just looked ... cheap, like a videotaped or live TV version of Lord of the Rings and not the epic return to Tolkien that we have all so long been waiting for. I still have hope for The Hobbit, but I'd be lying if I didn't say my expectations for the film have now been greatly diminished."
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by agentSmith View Post
oldschool play is about sportsmanship and respect, oldschool gear is available on Ebay.

Last edited by russc; 12-17-2012 at 07:19 PM.
russc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:35 PM   #126 (permalink)
Bruins World Order
 
StJimmy666's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: The Great White North (Sault Ste. Marie, ON)

AKA Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by russc View Post
All I know is that I prefer 24 and 30 fps to 48 and 60.

There are plenty of downloadable examples out there:

http://wemusic.veenue.com/libraries/...electric_0.mp4 (right click save as)

There are plenty of people out there who agree with me, too.
I definitely agree.
__________________
"You'll Never Walk Alone"
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny View Post
Seconded. Hence forth this is to be the official nomenclature of marker sales. Violators will be violated.
StJimmy666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:39 PM   #127 (permalink)
Post Whore
 
Flint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Toronto

Quote:
Originally Posted by russc View Post
All I know is that I prefer 24 and 30 fps to 48 and 60.

There are plenty of downloadable examples out there:

http://wemusic.veenue.com/libraries/...electric_0.mp4 (right click save as)

There are plenty of people out there who agree with me, too.
But all of them appear to repeat the same argument, that shows that people having hard time dropping preconceived notions and habits. I stick with the argument of people having hard time accepting that a 16fps movie should be watched in 16fps, and not in 24 or 30fps that it was shown to them all their lives.

Is it a matter of taste? absolutely, but taste can be developed.

One lingering suspicion though, which i think too many ignore - it may be a matter of physiology, same as 3d tech.
Flint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 08:11 PM   #128 (permalink)
Formerly DeTrevni
 
Magoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Houston, Tejas

Acquired tastes make no sense to me. If I don't like it, I don't like it, and forcing myself to like it through repeated exposure is borderline masochism. If you punch me in the throat every hour, every day, I'll be anxious and upset when you DON'T punch me in the throat...

I haven't seen the movie yet, but I will be avoiding the 48 FPS if I can. I heard it's limited release, though I'm not sure. I suffered the same problem with my HDTV and classic movies released in blue-ray. It's clarity seemed to draw out what was prop and set, and the suspense of disbelief was lost. It is reminisce of the uncanny valley idea, as Russc mentioned. It became so real, it seemed fake.
__________________
Wouldn't you really rather have a Buick?


Magoo is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 08:21 PM   #129 (permalink)
Bruins World Order
 
StJimmy666's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: The Great White North (Sault Ste. Marie, ON)

AKA Fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magoo View Post
Acquired tastes make no sense to me. If I don't like it, I don't like it, and forcing myself to like it through repeated exposure is borderline masochism. If you punch me in the throat every hour, every day, I'll be anxious and upset when you DON'T punch me in the throat...

I haven't seen the movie yet, but I will be avoiding the 48 FPS if I can. I heard it's limited release, though I'm not sure. I suffered the same problem with my HDTV and classic movies released in blue-ray. It's clarity seemed to draw out what was prop and set, and the suspense of disbelief was lost. It is reminisce of the uncanny valley idea, as Russc mentioned. It became so real, it seemed fake.
It's an acquired taste if you don't knoooow if you like it the first time, then grow to like it.
__________________
"You'll Never Walk Alone"
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny View Post
Seconded. Hence forth this is to be the official nomenclature of marker sales. Violators will be violated.
StJimmy666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 09:28 AM   #130 (permalink)
Post Whore
 
Join Date: Apr 2009

I don't know if what I saw was 48, 24 or what, but I noticed a difference and made a comment to my brother who was with me. I had no idea that there was supposed to be anything different about the way this was presented and made the comment that it "looked wierd". He apparently had some knowledge about there being a filming difference and gave a brief mention of it. I loved LOTR and just didnt like the "feel" of the Hobbit much. Seemed to be waaaaayy more CG than before, or at least it felt like it due to being able to pick it out. I forget his name, but the dude riding the white warg or whatever chasing the dwarves looked totally cartoonish the entire time as did all of the goblin scenes. I found it distracting as well that the Orcs seemed different than in LOTRs as well. While I enjoyed the movie, I expected more TBH.
OPBN is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  mcarterbrown.com » General » General Chat

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO
© MCB Network LLC