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Old 01-05-2013, 02:31 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Don't hold me to this, but I'm pretty sure one of the original versions of snow white was based around the fact that snow white was a vampire whore. I THINK Neil Gaiman revived it in his book Smoke&Mirrors.

Also, in the original little mermaid, I'm pretty sure the prince rejects her and she dies and disintegrates into foam. Which is where the term "mermaids foam" comes from. (it's that forthy white junk you see washing up on the beach)

one of the original red riding hoods ends with everyone being raped and eaten by the wolf.

EVERY fairy tale was in fact a way to scare children into behaving. If you can, find a really old translation of fairy tales, every one of them will either contain cannibalism, rape, murder, hell probably one or two involving the evils of incest. Might even luck out and get a story with a knockout combo or 2 or more! They are truly gnarly child scarring delights of yore.
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:22 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I've got a book of the original Grimm tales. I want to give them a read.
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:45 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I've got a book of the original Grimm tales. I want to give them a read.
i wonder which book has more nasty stuff in it

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Old 01-05-2013, 06:48 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I thought originally many fairytails were to frighten not just small children, but the peasants into staying out of places like the King's Woods. There are more out there that didn't make the popular cut into sterilized nursery story type too.

Robin McKinley has written books based on various fairytails and some of their older versions. One that sticks in my mind the most is Deerskin. Deerskin: Robin McKinley: 9780441000692: Amazon.com: Books It's a young adult one, but not overly bad, dramatic trauma stuff included.

Heinous, the really old folklore/fairy stories have quite a lot of corruption, sex, rape, nekked women, etc in them.
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:53 PM   #15 (permalink)
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that just begs the question at what age did people back then teach the birds and the bees, or else what point is there to scare kids with actual rape if they don't even know what sex is?
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Old 01-05-2013, 07:26 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Remember, those are times when people lived in much smaller places. Kids were exposed to farming, as well as night time at home in a place that might just be ONE room. What do you think Mommie and Daddie were doing? The more children you have, the easier it is to survive and keep farming.

It would be still frightening for kids, especially if you've seen livestock breeding. They tend to be noisy. Plus, there's still always the double standard of keeping your daughters "pure" even if your sons are not. (No one wants to doubt where their wife's baby could have come from.)
Like I said, many of these stories weren't focused as for children- but the lower class people in general back during those times. Who wants their wife/sister/mother/daughter to go out and get raped? Older laws weren't made like ours. Plus, if that happened, many times a husband might kick the woman out.

Also, the whole aversion to sex and it being EVIL wasn't as ingrained until the Puritans. Unfortunately, thanks to our roots the US is still steeped in that whole Puritan style sex taboo for the most part. Many other places around the world are much less inhibited than we are.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:00 PM   #17 (permalink)
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good point with the peasants listessa! that bit had slipped my mind, it was definitely easier to trick people back when 10% or less of the total population in the entire country could actually read.

Magoo, when was your copy of the grimm fairy tales printed?
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:44 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Magoo, when was your copy of the grimm fairy tales printed?
Pretty recently. I got it new for a Christmas a few years back. You don't think they'd censor it, do you? Wouldn't make a lot of sense, given what else is out there...
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:15 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Pretty recently. I got it new for a Christmas a few years back. You don't think they'd censor it, do you? Wouldn't make a lot of sense, given what else is out there...
Honestly couldn't say. Andrew Lang had several books published from the late 1800's to early 1900's you can read the stories here for free from Andrew Lang's Fairy Books I was told they were pretty raw.

no pictures like the actual books though...

Real quick before I head out, there is a newer version of peter pan that was written by Brom called "the child thief" that goes back to the old way of fairy tales and is an excellent read.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:48 PM   #20 (permalink)
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The wiki page tells a little about different editions of the old book.
Grimms' Fairy Tales - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You can download some on Project Gutenberg Household Stories by the Brothers Grimm by Jacob Grimm and Wilhelm Grimm - Project Gutenberg (just one selection, I haven't downloaded them yet.)

And if you're really into this folklore/fairystories here's a webpage starting with the brothers Grimm that has more to offer to. Read Brothers Grimm fairy tales online!
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