General

[Christian Nelson]

BTW, my piston soak didn't require me to remove the seafoam, the cylinders were dry after a couple of days. I looked down into the sparkplug holes, with a flashlight.

I ended up doing two piston soaks, two days of sitting each time, then fired it up after all that.

[mustangii]

I guess I'll weigh in on this. For those who do not know, I am an ASE master Certified Automotive Tech.

#1 Get under the car and see if you have any leaks, If it is dry then move on, Pay attention to the pressure sensor. If you see oil on the connector change the sensor. If you want to check the pressure use a mechanical gauge in the oil sensor hole. pressure at idle should be no less than 7 psi.

#2 most modern vehicles use low tension rings, that means better fuel milage, but increced oil consumption. manufacturs spec say that up to 2 quarts between oil changes is normal.

#3 If any leaks under the vehicle like fnt and rear main seals could be caused by sticking PCV valve, don't try to clean replace it.

#4 If gaskets are leaking replace them, don't tighten the bolts.

#5 The only additive I would recamend is Lucus products. Seafoam to me is equal to the multitude of snake oil products to fix problems that need to be mechanical repaired.

Just my 2 cents

edm

[PhantomXJ]

Seafoam isnt really an oil product, its a multipurpose cleaner.
To me Lucas oil stabilizer is just an oil thickener.

I run seafoam through my intake about every 10,000miles and it seems to help it idle smoother(i assume its from any carbon that was build up on the valves....). Anyways I had the intake/exhaust manifolds off my inline six that has 160,000mile on it to replace a core/freeze plug. The inside of the manifolds were incredibly clean unlike most of them i have seen off of high milage vehicles, for me this is enough proof that seafoam removes carbon buildup in engines.

Seafoam is not supposed to fix leaks or anything so i dont see how its a "fake" product such as aftermarket octane boosters.

[mustangii]

I can show you that you can do the same thing by misting plain water thru your intake on a engine that is at operating temp. It will break up crabon deposits because you are injecting a cooler substance into a hot enviroment which causes carbon cracking and break away, In the exhaust the heat of combustion turns the water to steam and steam cleans the exhaust. why spend the money? Lucus products are stabilizers not thickeners. I've used it since my Neon was new and it has 250,000 miles on it. It has the origenal head gasket. I have changed the timing belt and water pump. change the plugs every 30,000 miles, oil every 6000, that's about every 5 weeks as much as my wife drives it between work and scouting activities
edm

[PhantomXJ]

But would you put water in your oil(I wouldnt advocate using seafoam in the oil for prolonger periods anyway).
Lucas oil stabilizer still does thicken the oil, I will admit i have used it with success when my rear main seal was leaking. $8 for stabilizer was alot cheaper than a new crankshaft or speedy sleeve.

I guess im just in the mood to argue

Anyway the water method doesnt produce excessive amounts of smoke out the exhaust.

Im curious as to what oil stabilizer has to due with the head gasket?

[Mr. Furious]

Originally Posted by mustangii

For those who do not know, I am an ASE master Certified Automotive Tech.

Why has the discussion continued beyond this statement? It's like arguing with your brain surgeon about what needs to be done in your head....

[PhantomXJ]

Originally Posted by Mr. Furious

Why has the discussion continued beyond this statement? It's like arguing with your brain surgeon about what needs to be done in your head....

I am not ASE certified myself but i recently went to a school with 30+ ASE Master Certified Instructors. Half the time i would ask two seperate ones the same question i would get two different awnsers. I have met ppl who were ASE certified on brake systems and didnt even know how to turn rotors.

I had one teacher who hasnt worked on heavy trucks or diesel engines that has a T2 Diesel Engine and a T6 Electrical Certification.

My point is that just because a person is certified doesnt mean that they are ALWAYS right(just most of the time).

[Christian Nelson]

I happen to be ASE certified as well. Not master, but you know.. Just saying..

I ever claimed the piston soak would fix the problem. It does break up carbon, as you even admit.

IF the problem is cause by carbon causing the rings to stick, and IF the seafoam will clean them enough to loosen up THEN it will work for this problem. I did list other possibilities, such as front and rear mains, oilpan, head, and valve cover gaskets. Along with oil sender, and PCV. I happen to know that Saturns in particular designed the oil return holes at the oil ring in the piston skirt on the smallish side because they were wanting to put 5W30 in them, and were concerned that the oild would dry up. UN fortunately, whn you get some carbon build up, or sludgy oil from not changing, you end up with a blockage, and sticking rings. You can have immaculate cylinder walls, and buring oil form this problem. GM actually made a product specifically to combat this issue, only available from thier dealerships. Costs an arma nd a leg to have this done by them. A cheaper alternative is Seafoam, or Marvel Mystery Oil. Heck, even water, as you noted.

The long term fix is to drill larger holes out in the piston skirts, or buy after market pistons with this modification, and change to an oil that will resist carbonizing, and sludging. One can get buy if they can free up the rings, with changing to an oil that won't carbonize or sludge, and not have to pull the pistons. This could save time and $$$. For $3 a can, it was worth a shot. Given the mileage on his Saturn, it was likely to be this issue.

I am well aware that nothing in a can will fix a mechanical problem. It turns out that this particular problem does indeed show promise of a fix in a can.

I don't see what info you have provided that I didn't, other than saying you were ASE, which I am as well, but didn't feel the need to thump my chest about it.

[Christian Nelson]

Originally Posted by PhantomXJ

I am not ASE certified myself but i recently went to a school with 30+ ASE Master Certified Instructors. Half the time i would ask two seperate ones the same question i would get two different awnsers. I have met ppl who were ASE certified on brake systems and didnt even know how to turn rotors.

I had one teacher who hasnt worked on heavy trucks or diesel engines that has a T2 Diesel Engine and a T6 Electrical Certification.

My point is that just because a person is certified doesnt mean that they are ALWAYS right(just most of the time).

One could say the same thing about doctors too. I can't get straight answers out of them usually either. I'm going deaf, go to 5 different doctors, they all say something different is causing it.

What am I supposed to think? All I know is that my music is being taken from me, nothing I play anymore sounds right, everything sounds out of tune, and I can't even sing anymore, because one ear hears a different pitch than the other, and I am not sure which one is right.

Don't tell me doctors are all knowing. Sometimes I think they just memorize a bunch of big words, and throw them out randomly and just guess like te rest of us.

[Mr. Furious]

If you don't trust someone's knowledge and expertise that went through the training and studied hard to pass the tests to attain a certification or title what's the point of having "professionals"?

Furthermore, people who do something for a living have a little thing called "experience" that teaches them over years of doing the same thing what works, what doesn't and what hurts more than helps. I can read about anything I want to know about in a book but that does not mean I'm just as capable of doing it as someone who is certified and actually does it on a regular basis.

All I'm saying is that professionals know what they're talking about and most of the time what they tell you first will be the thing you end up finding out for yourself after all the stuff you tried because you were sure you knew better failed. I have experience at failing because I knew better many times in the past and found myself doing what the professionals said after time and money were wasted.