General

[Cunha]

As long as Ron Paul would let us have a large enough military to defend ourselves and even be large enough to be preventative.

Its too bad he was obviously the best possible choice. He just got horrible horrible coverage on television.

[Azzy]

Not to mention all the people out there who would actually get off their duffs and do something for themselves. He wouldnt have a chance in most cities which get so many governemnt kickbacks.

[DarkStar]

Ok, so i read through a good deal of the fair tax site and I must admit it sounds pretty good. The only thing I don't seem to understand is the "prebate".

"All valid Social Security cardholders who are U.S. residents receive a monthly prebate equivalent to the FairTax paid on essential goods and services, also known as the poverty level expenditures."

Everyone gets a check for this amount regardless of whether they work or are a homeless bum? If I choose to live as a vagrant and eat raman noodles i can do so on the governments dime?

it's probably way less than is spent on these individuals under the current system, but I'm just making sure I understand.

[Azzy]

I think it is the only way to shut up those who get a "refund" every year, but dont actually pay taxes.

it also keeps the stores form having to setup a system to figure if a sale was taxable or not.

[Drum]

Nobody wants to pay for anything... what a bunch of cheap bastids!



Sure, you can fall back on legends of governmental excess (who hasn't heard of a $500 toilet seat?) but I find it interesting how quickly everyone assumes that any spending that does not interest them is somehow wasted expenditure.

My wife is always grousing about having to pay school taxes when we will not be putting any children through that system. I always try to remind her that she is paying so that the cashier at the super market will be able to give her the right change.

I also find it interesting how many of you have indicated a certain pass for the military. Everyone can talk about how unpatriotic it is to send troops to combat and not give them all the money in the world to protect themselves and kill the enemy better. Seems to be a common saw in these election days.

But what about the mailman? Or the tax collector or the park rangers, etc., etc., and onward. As the OP stated, there are a lot of your fellow Americans who are part of the governmental infrastructure handling a dizzying array of everything you can think of.

Is there waste? Sure. There is waste in every single budget in every single household and business across this land. Why should the government be any different?

I think, rather than slashing and burning the existing infrastructure, there should always be ongoing efforts to make things more efficient. However, if your eyes are only on the bottom line and cutting taxes, then there are a lot of people, including many here, who will be in dire straits for one reason or another.

Paying taxes is patriotic.



PS: The most expensive thing that we have done as Americans in the last eight years was declaring war on terrorism. If we cut that out, we can pay for all sorts of things that would help our fellow Americans so they will be strong and rich when the terrorists finally follow us home.

[Azzy]

Schools? Yup, the government is doing a great job at that.

If Joe and Susie (The Plumber) Sixpack didnt both have to go to work because the average middle class person pays about 50% in taxes, then maybe one of them could stay home and teach the kids. Or, work and pay for an education for the kids in the manner of their choosing.

The mailman? let the post office survive on it's own. If Fed EX takes it over because they do a better job for a better price, that's the breaks.

Tax collector? largely not needed. Doesnt the IRS spend $.42 of ever $1 they collect on collecting taxes?

Park rangers and etc.. cant that be paid for by fees for using the land? What about hunting permits and such?

How come so many businesses can survive at the same things Government cant ever seem to do. Amtrak is government run, and there is no way for it ever to make a profit. Ever.

[Drum]

Perhaps the government fails at certain things because of a epidemic lack of funding.
It is easy to find fault. Heck, if Joe Plumber's wife is teaching the kid, she might do it wrong too. And then who will have to pick up the pieces?

You guessed it.

I think it would be easy to imagine the results of a world without government.

Just go out and pick up one of the "Road Warrior" movies...

[MadCat]

I'm not sure if the US government coined the phrase "use it or lose it", but it's definitely the methodology used in budget formulation.

I worked at DFAS (Defense Financial and Accounting Service) for about 6 years. Though I wasn't in the comptroller's office, it's still pretty close to being an insider on how the defense agencies spend their allotment.

It's no lie that if a business unit failed to spend every penny of their allotted budget, then their future budget would be reduced accordingly. There simply isn't any incentive for the agencies to work more efficiently. Lifelong career bureaucrats are imbedded into every agency. Those who are motivated to run an efficient unit do so, the others just do their job and try not to raise much attention. Without the proper accountability (like having to maintain a profit margin - in the private sector), you just don't get the same results.

Things may have changed since I've entered the private sector, but I doubt it.

[DarkStar]

Originally Posted by Drum

I also find it interesting how many of you have indicated a certain pass for the military. Everyone can talk about how unpatriotic it is to send troops to combat and not give them all the money in the world to protect themselves and kill the enemy better. Seems to be a common saw in these election days.

I believe people who put their lives on the line for the rest of us deserve a better shake than some schmuck cleaning toilets at the state house. To me there is a huge difference between putting your life on the line to serve your country (or city in the case of police/firemen) and everyone else who works for the Feds/States.