mcarterbrown.com  

Paintball News The latest in paintball news brought to you by the oldest independent publication in paintball and the best paintball site on the web - The Paintball News and MCB

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-23-2010, 03:00 AM   #1 (permalink)
Rec Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2009

Updated SA-8 Information.. For all other posts and thoughts

First I would like to thank the many members that supported our efforts to help player's who may have purchased an SA-8. Those who really know us realize that our motive on this is not profit, it is safety. Thanks as well to all of you have have contacted us to return these products, the efforts to promote safe play are commendable and the spirit that help further our sport.

Second, it was not my intention to post the safety warning and walk away as though that would be the end of it. As one of the members who called the office noted I was out of the office, actually on vacation with my family at Disney World. The fact is I was notified of this issue several hours before getting on a plane. I contacted Pepperball to make sure they knew who their $99 price was attracting, paintball players, not those interested in a less lethal launcher. Since they weren't acting on the matter I pulled time from my family to try and help a situation that was obviously snowballing fast.

Third, Tiberius Arms did not sell these products to any retail customer, Pepperball did, so we aren't trying to cover any liability issues we are trying to address a legitimate safety concern.

I will be honest, I have not read through all of the posts so I apologize if I don't address every question posed but I will do my best to cover the major/recurring issues that have been raised.

First, the SA-8’s are not paintball markers, they are Pepperball launchers, and despite what many are posting there is a big difference. While paintball markers without overpressure relief valves may exist they do not operate in the same manner as our markers. Most lack regulators all together and are therefore designed to operate using CO2 full pressure, our system is not. Most markers featuring a regulator are designed with either a relief valve, or a failure point (that is to say an o-ring/solenoid gasket, etc. that is designed to give out before over pressurization becomes a safety issue), the SA8 lacks this feature. It is important to note that many SA8's may be able to be adjusted to below 300fps, however in the event of a regulator o-ring failure they lack the ability to vent and maintain a velocity that is safe for paintball. {Note: Many have sited the Automag which is a decent example, most didn't realize the have a pressure relief (probably because they didn't want it tampered with). As many who have used an Automag with CO2, or turn the velocity way up can attest they begin leaking out of the back of the regulator, the SA8 does not.} I am not going to debate every form of every marker ever made, even if other markers were/are capable of this failure it does not mean we believe it is safe and most importantly they don't have our name on them.

Second, could we try to manufacture a relief assembly as a drop in replacement, yes, do we feel that is a prudent course of action, no, and here is why. First, the SA-8 Pepperball launchers are etched “Not for recreational use” and were colored in blue and orange (known training and less lethal color choices of the police and military) for a reason. If we make exceptions to this because paintballers thought they found a deal that was too good to be true (and was), we would be doing all of the agencies who use our less lethal equipment a disservice. Additionally we would be telling fields that saw the “Not for recreational use” warning to ignore it, a very dangerous precedent to set. We would also further the incorrect assumption that less lethal weapons can be safely used for paintball. Many are right about the fact that we could try to make this for very little and sell it for a lot to those who are stuck with a purchase that isn’t what they thought it was...this should show our motive is not profit. Despite many peoples assumptions we didn't over extend ourselves by selling to Pepperball, they have chosen to sell these products at a huge loss, which is there right.

Likewise our effort isn’t to reward paintball player’s who purchased SA-8’s, as it has become clear to me that most knew that it was not be a wise decision. We are not demanding anyone return their SA-8, they are a wonderful product for home defense or law enforcement applications. What we are doing is making sure that players who go out to participate in a fun day of play at their local field aren’t subject to unnecessary risk as a result of another player’s careless “good deal”. So many have asked if we are going to "tell fields about these"? Yes, we have a professional and ethical obligation to do so to protect players and field owners. We make no apologies about this point and are amazed the risks people are willing to take to I have experienced a lot of “too good to be true(s)” in my time and can’t remember one where I was offered the chance to get out of that bad decision with nearly as much as we have tried to offer paintball player’s who purchased an SA-8.

As a result of speaking with many SA8 purchasers, reading these forums, and attempting to provide as many opt outs as possible we have decided to offer a $50 gift certificate for those wishing to return only the SA8 launcher. As most have noted the magazines alone are worth $100, so this provides a potentially better fit for many.

Gift Certificates are redeemable directly through Tiberius Arms (all products priced at MAP). I will be posting a complete list of products/prices shortly.

I respect that not everyone will agree with our efforts, or believe our motives but as a company we are really trying to do an honorable thing.

UPDATE:
We are allowing SA8 launchers that have been stripped and/or painted to be returned. SA8 launchers that have been modified will be evaluated on a case by case basis. So long as the modified units are complete (not stripped of parts, intentionally/excessively damaged) I do not foresee any problem with them being returned.

We have received a lot of requests for return information so here goes:

1. Go to http://service.tiberiusarms.com
2. Click "Register new account"
3. Click "New Ticket"
3. Enter the information requested. Note: the marker type selected does not matter
4. Please type "SA8 Return" in the problem description section
5. Credit card information only needs to be entered if you are redeeming your gift certificate immediately for an item(s) that exceed the value of your gift certificate. Note: Please be sure to account for a nominal shipping charge (we charge exact shipping, no handling fees, etc. most orders cost between $5-$8 to ship).

Shipping Address:
Tiberius Arms
2717 Ferguson Rd
Fort Wayne, IN 46809

Upon receipt we will contact you by phone and/or email to confirm receipt.
Attached Images
File Type: pdf 2010 MAP Pricing.pdf (158.8 KB, 378 views)

Last edited by TiberiusArms; 02-24-2010 at 11:52 AM.
TiberiusArms is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 03:26 AM   #2 (permalink)
ex-cyborg
 
melkson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Central Colorado
Send a message via Yahoo to melkson

Brass N Wood Fan
nice offer to see, you may get alot of takers on that. Would it be possible to make an offer of X first strike tubes or something of a definate value. Maybe another mag, accessories, something where the owner has to spend little/nothing?
melkson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 04:11 AM   #3 (permalink)
Active Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009

I think your response to this issue is more than honorable. Hats off to Tiberius Arms.
Posey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 05:00 AM   #4 (permalink)
Active Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Machesney park, IL

I also salute you on your responce to all of us to not only clarify, but set to rest any lingering issues/debate.

I also commend you on offering not only one (the $100 certificate) rebate, but two ($50 gun only).

This was done soley out of the goodness of your heart since legally and morally you were in no way required to do so.

Scrounger
scrounger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 08:26 AM   #5 (permalink)
la la la la revolution
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: MN

$50 for the gun only is a generous deal!

Now I have to decide whether to turn in the SA-8 and get another mag, or keep it for spare parts for my incoming T8... That's a nice decision to be able to make.

Are the gift certificates usable only through Tiberius, or through your resellers too?

edit:
Quote:
Gift Certificates are redeemable directly through Tiberius Arms (all products priced at MAP). I will be posting a complete list of products/prices shortly.
Thank you.


Also, the 8.1 doesn't seem to have an overpressure relief in the videos and pictures I've seen. There's no PDF of the manual available. Does it have one, or doesn't it need one?

Last edited by MondoMor; 02-23-2010 at 10:27 AM.
MondoMor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 08:29 AM   #6 (permalink)
Active Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008

Definitely hats off.....

That is quite a deal.

At this point I retract my statement about marketing shenanigans.....and apologize for making the comment.

What do we need to send in to return these and get the $50 card?

Last edited by Stonedog; 02-24-2010 at 08:08 AM.
Stonedog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 09:13 AM   #7 (permalink)
MCBs armed pacifist
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: West Michigan

Aside from a few thank-yous to Eric and Tiberius for both the offers and clearing it up it should. I don't think anyone could have reasonably expected anything more from Tiberius. Thank-you
__________________
"The Truth is the same no matter under what name it is taught, or who teaches it. Strip it of the personal coloring of the teacher and it is seen to be the same--THE TRUTH" - William Walker Atkinson

"Use peaceful means where they are appropriate; but where they are not appropriate, do not hesitate to resort to more forceful - Thupten Gyatso (the Dalai Lama, 1932)

"It is not the will to win that matters - everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters" Coach Paul 'Bear' Bryant.

"The ink of scholars is more precious than the blood of martyrs" - Muhammed
Lohman446 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 09:19 AM   #8 (permalink)
TANSTAAFL
 
Critical's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: People's Republic of Maryland

CCM Fan
One remaining question that should be answered is if launchers that have had their anodizing or powdercoat removed will still qualify for your return offer.
__________________
Running on an odd number of cylinders
Quote:
Originally Posted by jincay View Post
"WHY is that guy licking Criticals pants?"
My Feedback
Critical is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 09:27 AM   #9 (permalink)
Facta Non Verba
 
Deuce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: SCMO
Send a message via MSN to Deuce

Fan of EMR
CCM Fan
Props to Eric and Tib for trying to make the most out of a bad situation.

I don't buy that people didn't know what they were getting, that's a joke but I'm glad to see the support you guys are putting out there. I'm sure you will see many takers on the return option.

Wish it was warmer here for your vacation Eric!
__________________

Co-Captain/ Co-Founder
Team-Awesome

Quote:
Originally Posted by CCMachinist View Post
$400 per 1000

smoke'em if you got'em.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chopper duke View Post
I'd wipe, play-on and overshoot.
Deuce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-23-2010, 09:37 AM   #10 (permalink)
Popeye
 
paulduckson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Yo mommas pants

I feel like a douche now, and hats off ta. 6 mags for roghly 150$ is enough of a deal to make myself purchase a legit t-8
paulduckson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  mcarterbrown.com » General » Paintball News

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:57 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO
© MCB Network LLC