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Old 01-05-2011, 11:14 AM   #31 (permalink)
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I already have a home brew uv hopper for my a-5.. I built one just to see that the old UV pb manufacturer went out of business.. I found cases on e-bay but they were 80+ shipping, and I didnt want to risk a 80 dollar case on e-bay.. My ears are perked at this point.
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Old 01-05-2011, 03:02 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by alpha434 View Post
You don't feel like you might be at a disadvantage against players shooting 3.2 gram paintballs?

The Hydrotec paintballs will be 15% inferior to the standard paint. 15% inferior range and 15% inferior resistance to being affected by wind.

Something tells me that this is a backstep. And hydrotec will not sell well.
I agree. My concern is that they are trying to convince field operators who are increasingly going to Field Paint Only, to make a switch. If this happens, players playing at that field will be forced to use this poorer performing paint. If you don't have a lot of fields in your area (only two within 1hr of me), this may effectively force you to shoot this paint .
Here's the scarier part for me: What if in return for field operators getting hydrotech at a huge discount, they are being required to not sell other paintballs of any sort? If this stuff has a solid shelf life, field operators wouldn't mind committing so much since they can order more knowing it won't go to crap on the shelf.

This could further reduce my opportunities to shoot First Strike rounds. I presently have to travel 90minutes+ just to use them at a field that allows them because one of my local fields just out and out said 'no' as they were switching to FPO (this is after their manager had me shoot him and he said the impact was softer). While the other field has a paint manufacturer relationship that allows for FPO enforcement based on fill color (all of their paint is that creamsicle orange) and they're not sure if they want to go through the motions of getting custom colored paint from Tiberius.
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Old 01-05-2011, 04:29 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Being that they are marketing more toward fields than players i would not be surprised to see this stuff take off. i know if i was field owner and someone told me if i buy this cheaper product then i can also save time and money on maintenance AND i don't have to buy paint by the week and pay for shipping! if i was a field owner i would be stupid not to take that offer. personally as far as i am concerned as long as everybody is on the same boat with maybe a ~15% reduction in performance i am ok with that.
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Old 01-05-2011, 04:52 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha434 View Post
You don't feel like you might be at a disadvantage against players shooting 3.2 gram paintballs?

The Hydrotec paintballs will be 15% inferior to the standard paint. 15% inferior range and 15% inferior resistance to being affected by wind.

Something tells me that this is a backstep. And hydrotec will not sell well.
You also have to consider that the HydroTec paintballs will be more consistent than regular paintballs. They are said to be virtually seamless and almost perfectly filled, meaning they should be more accurate, possibly negating these issues. I'd much rather have a more accurate ball than one that flies an extra 10'.

Another thing to consider is that, being 15% lighter, they're going to hurt less. I think that's going to be a pretty big advantage in the end.
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Old 01-05-2011, 05:07 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Well... First off. If a field has problems with storing paint for too long, then storing the paint is the least of their worries. The fields around me are cycling between 2 and 6 pallets per month. So nothing stays on the shelf for that long.

When you get crap paint at a field, it's exactly that. Crap paint from the factory. If it's actually old paint, then that's the death mark for a lot of fields.

As far as saving on shipping... Freight is by the pallet, and doesn't get cheaper. The price isn't time dependent.

What I'm seeing is an imminent quality of play reduction. I hope that you all are well prepared to let other players know the differences after this shakes out.

Halo.... An easy way to get first strikes allowed is to ask about grenades. I've never been to a field that won't allow grenades. So when talking to management, I start referring to grenades as special ordinance. And then link First Strike rounds in the same category. If they don't ask for field paint grenades, then why ask fr field paint FS? You aren't going to walk out onto the field with either one exclusively. And even if you did, then they're getting your field fee for not much to clean up.

EDIT: (For wrath) Nobody cares how much paintball hurts. They care about effective target delivery. If the above two statements were not true, then 50 caliber would be the standard. There's your 10 feet less and less pain right there. And then some!

One more thing. It's apparent that you, specifically, wrath. Were not around when Tom Kaye blessed us with Perfect Circle paintballs.

The perfectly round shell has been done before. And at the same price as Marbalizers during that time period, Perfect Circle paint was not good enough to stay on the market.

Last edited by alpha434; 01-05-2011 at 05:12 PM.
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Old 01-05-2011, 06:39 PM   #36 (permalink)
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You make some valid points, but saying no one cares about the pain level is as ignorant of a statement as I have ever heard. So it may be true that the majority of the veteran players have become accustom to the sting, and would never trade distance for a less painful ball. BUT many new players are turned away do to pain. I have seen it first hand, new players loving the sport - minus the pain. Many never return and share the fact that the pain turned them off. And word of mouth spreads and people become turned off to the sport. If these did hurt less ( I personally want to reserve all judgment on pain, accuracy and distance till actually testing the product - odd I know) there is a possibility field owners could market them to private groups and it could increase sales, margins and repeat business.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 01-05-2011, 07:17 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Yes, I am concerned about the possible decrease in distance that we could see using lighter 'balls. However, I am remaining optimistic until testing is complete. Considering how tiny paint is these days, I would be surprised if most paint on the market weighs more than 3.0 grams.

I love the fact that it will be pretty consistent at .686. I also am quite excited at the shelf life. Although this may be moot for many field owners, for recreational players it will be great. I often end up buying a case of paint that may take me several months to shoot if I am playing infrequently and using my Sniper II a bunch. Additionally, if it is as round as advertised, it will have to shoot better than the stuff I have been getting ahold of recently.

Testing from cockerpunk is to take place soon after hitting the market and I am awaiting the results before letting the weight issue make or break this for me.

And, if nothing else, maybe it will get the attention of the industry and wake them up to the fact that players do want paint that is bigger than .680 and is consistently round. Maybe, just maybe RPS will bring back the Advantage shell as a result of Hydrotec.
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Old 01-05-2011, 07:54 PM   #38 (permalink)
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I pay a flat rate for shipping on my paint, if I can get more (say a full pallet rather then a half) I do actually save money. 15% can be significant but I'm not sure it's a deal breaker in this case. I'm waiting to see if it's what it's cracked up to be.
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Old 01-05-2011, 09:50 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LU_aDaK View Post
You make some valid points, but saying no one cares about the pain level is as ignorant of a statement as I have ever heard. So it may be true that the majority of the veteran players have become accustom to the sting, and would never trade distance for a less painful ball. BUT many new players are turned away do to pain. I have seen it first hand, new players loving the sport - minus the pain. Many never return and share the fact that the pain turned them off. And word of mouth spreads and people become turned off to the sport. If these did hurt less ( I personally want to reserve all judgment on pain, accuracy and distance till actually testing the product - odd I know) there is a possibility field owners could market them to private groups and it could increase sales, margins and repeat business.

Just my 2 cents.
Ok. So discuss further.
Why not 50 caliber?

Tug, Why not 50 caliber? If 15% isn't a deal breaker, then why is 25%?

I get a flat rate on my paint too. Per pallet. I can have them stack it 130 cases high if I want. But I still pay per pallet. Just out of curiosty, what is your paint usage like that you're holding paint for longer than you can store it? Maybe I can sell you some good stuff.


Here's my perspective on the pain issue. Paintball is a complex game based on risk and reward. The more pain you risk, the greater the endorphin resonse when you're successful. I sincerely doubt that players who do not have enough endorphin response when faced with this type of situation would stay with the sport, regardless of how much pain is gambled.
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Old 01-05-2011, 10:55 PM   #40 (permalink)
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alpha434, I can tell that you are pretty passionate about the game of paintball and that is great for there to be passionate people playing the sport. It just seems that you trying to label this new product as being inferior to other brands without giving a benefit of doubt and waiting to see actual on the field tests.

Now I'm not talking staged tests, I'm talking several players, hoppers filled with hydrotec paintballs and flinging them back and forth at each other. I'm trying, as well as others, to be optimistic that this new company might make a decent paintball with good shelf life. Sure if you kept the same paint on your self for two years, you have more problems then worrying about the paint going bad. I feel that the shelf life is just one of those things to give field owners that warm and fuzzy feeling about buyng their brand...you know like a guarantee. I have never seen a past or present case where competition was bad for the pursuit of better technology.

Of course, you could just be stating concerns that could be coming across as arrogant claims that this new paintball company will fail. This is the internet where everything is misunderstood because we cannot see your face and hear the tone in your voice to determine your attitude towards this.
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