General

[EgoPossum]

Hey fellow MCBers,

So as a few people on here know I work in the only paintball proshop in my home town of Thunder Bay, Ontario. Thunder Bay is located roughly about an hour away from the Minnesota/Canada border.

For the last while we have been noticing alot of crack downs on replica firearms and airsoft guns. One of the principals at one of the local high schools got busted trying to import some airsoft guns that were very close to the firearms that are on the prohibited firearms list (Canada is funny like this)
Paintball it seems is now having some issues right now. The field that is closest to town was raided by the police, the owner had some gear seized, told that he could have been charged under an anti-terrorism act for all the "replica firearms" that he had at the field for sale and could have been arrested on the spot. They did leave the rental markers (Custom 98, BT-4, A-5).
We got in contact with the other field in town and with our suppliers to see what is going on and get the word out.

Our store was just visited by one of the head guys for the officers for the guns and gangs unit. He asked alot of questions regarding the FPS that these shoot at, rate of fire, but was really interested in the ones that look like real firearms (TM-15, TM-7, BT Omega, Tippmann Bravo One, Tiberius T8.1/9.1, Tippmann TiPX, GOG G1, BT Delta Elite, Tippmann X-7 Phenom). He is going to the Crown Attorney about what he finds and is going to inform us of their decision on if it is "legal" to sell paintball markers or at least the ones that look like the real thing locally.
He was a nice guy and didn't know alot regarding paintball and I know with regards to our firearms codes in Canada that it is up to to officer in question on how to interpret the firearms code that these fall under.

Here is where I ask for a hand from my fellow MCarter-ites:
I need help here. I like my job and I am willing to fight for it.
Without paintball at our store, we would closed have about 6 years ago. Paintball has been good to me for the last few years and this would be a major blow to the Thunder Bay paintball community.
If there is anyone that can give us a hand or information that can help us, please comment below or PM myself or Trimmer (my co-worker). I am willing to work with the police and make this work so that all parties can be happy.
To the mods: If I have this in the wrong place, feel free to move it.

[russc]

The only paintball guns which are illegal to import to Canada are the RAP4/RAM .43 cals, and maybe the .68 Cal Shotguns from them.

To be considered illegal replicas, they must be 1:1 scale copies of a real gun. "Gunlike" doesn't make it illegal. "Scary" doesn't make it illegal. Orange tips are not necessary.

Never state that velocity goes over 500 fps. They ask that question because under Canada's firearm laws, 500+fps turns it into a real firearm. Be very careful answering any technical questions about the guns. I have had CBSA officers ask me "how many psi does it shoot?" Obviously, the answer with my ATS AT-10 was "850," but they would have flipped **** because they were confusing PSI with FPS.

As for the Principal being busted for importing Airsoft, it is what it is. That's the risk you run when you import replicas, and why Airsoft is more expensive in Canada.

Now that said, yes, local authorities can interpret the laws differently. I've had a KP confiscated at the border for being a "real gun", and after hounding different phone lines for a while, they released it without explanation or apology.

Take a deep breath, you're fine. You just have a local cop with nothing better to do, and a weak grasp on the actual laws governing paintball guns.

[Mr.Smith]

I'd suggest looking into specifically what acts/laws they used to seize the markers and then look them over to see if there is actually anything there that allows police to seize them.

[foughtwolf]

The ATF did the same thing in the US to some poor airsoft shop not long ago. But then again the ATF does plenty of shady stuff.

Best of luck to you, bunch of retards running your country must take notes from out collection, and vise-versa.

[russc]

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Didn't they do that raid because they were seizing airsoft guns that had functional AR-15 lowers?

[Mr.Smith]

Originally Posted by russc

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Didn't they do that raid because they were seizing airsoft guns that had functional AR-15 lowers?

The lower doesn't count as a "gun", only the upper. By itself, no laws apply to it.

[russc]

I think you've got that backwards, at least when it comes to AR-15s.

[Mr.Smith]

Originally Posted by russc

I think you've got that backwards, at least when it comes to AR-15s.

"Generally, the law views the receiver as that part of a firearm housing that has the serial number upon it. Thus, in the case of a firearm that has multiple receivers (such as the AR-15, which has an upper and lower receiver), the legally controlled part is the one that is serialized (the lower, in the AR-15's case)." -Guns World, sept. 2007

Right you are sir!

[foughtwolf]

Originally Posted by russc

/\ /\

Didn't they do that raid because they were seizing airsoft guns that had functional AR-15 lowers?

They had 'functional' lowers in the way that if you put it together with normal airsoft parts, it would make an airsoft rifle. Any form of real steel function lower made from even a high grade metal airsoft lower would simply crack under the pressure, and would require extensive modification to even function for the whole 5 rounds it might fire before breaking apart. They were the same design that has been coming from overseas for years and still is. The ATF just got a huge mad-on for that place, saw rifles and went to town with no data to back up their claims about possible conversions. Id bet the same things are being tagged onto the current mishap in Thunder Bay.

The matter is, that if someone was going to illegally make an Ar using parts, it would be cheaper and easier to purchase 80 percent finished lowers, instead of a 4-500 dollar airsoft rifle.

[tony montana 2]

Originally Posted by Mr.Smith

The lower doesn't count as a "gun", only the upper. By itself, no laws apply to it.

you got that backwards it's the lowers that are the firearm on a AR. The lower has the serial number and is regulated the upper is not.