General

[Tugboater203]

This thread is fine where it is.

Poe- I believe that the NPPL is the customer, not Tadao. The NPPL is supplying the chips to the player and will want them to be as universal as possible. Since there is (to a degree) a standard in the boards then they should work regardless of the brand of the board. I imagine they're fairly similar to the RF chips in the Pulse hoppers in terms of their intergration.

[weerez935]

awh. that makes much more sense

[P0E]

Originally Posted by Tugboater203

Poe- I believe that the NPPL is the customer, not Tadao. The NPPL is supplying the chips to the player and will want them to be as universal as possible. Since there is (to a degree) a standard in the boards then they should work regardless of the brand of the board. I imagine they're fairly similar to the RF chips in the Pulse hoppers in terms of their integration.

I don't think anyone is said they don't work, are not compatible or their 'customer' is Tadao. Did you read the posts?

They will be selling and licensing the 'chips' to other board makers because 'integrated' chips are an absolute inevitability. Virtue will make boards with this CHIP included and charge a premium. They will gain a reputation of being "top of the line" purely because of the 'integrated tournament feature' and higher price. In order to compete, other board makers will need to include this board.

The Virtue Clock's future RF upgrade will share the same format (not the same as the hopper RF). Can you think long distance planning?

[Tugboater203]

Originally Posted by P0E

I don't think anyone is said they don't work, are not compatible or their 'customer' is Tadao. Did you read the posts?

They will be selling and licensing the 'chips' to other board makers because 'integrated' chips are an absolute inevitability. Virtue will make boards with this CHIP included and charge a premium. They will gain a reputation of being "top of the line" purely because of the 'integrated tournament feature' and higher price. In order to compete, other board makers will need to include this board.

The Virtue Clock's future RF upgrade will share the same format (not the same as the hopper RF). Can you think long distance planning?

Yes I read the whole thread so you can drop the tone.

Why are integrated chips inevitable? I'd rebut that they are the last thing the NPPL would want in the hands of the players. Anti cheating devices in the hands of the participants get tampered with all the time. It's in the NPPL's interest to keep these chips out of the players hands so that they can't be tampered with in between events. An easy way to do that is to change chips (even just their color) at every event or on an annual basis.

[P0E]

Originally Posted by Tugboater203

...
Why are integrated chips inevitable? I'd rebut that they are the last thing the NPPL would want in the hands of the players. Anti cheating devices in the hands of the participants get tampered with all the time. It's in the NPPL's interest to keep these chips out of the players hands so that they can't be tampered with in between events. An easy way to do that is to change chips (even just their color) at every event or on an annual basis.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the players get to keep these ROOFFI™ devices, no? A minor software change is the only way Virtue could make next year's ROOFFI™ non-compatible since the FCC closely regulates how the physical layer is handled. Such a software hurdle is nothing.

At least the device name is fitting.

Originally Posted by Tugboater203

I believe that the NPPL is the customer, not Tadao.

No tone there? I swear there's some tone there. Without non-verbal communication our tone meters are known for false positives.

[Tugboater203]

Originally Posted by P0E

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the players get to keep these ROOFFI™ devices, no? A minor software change is the only way Virtue could make next year's ROOFFI™ non-compatible since the FCC closely regulates how the physical layer is handled. Such a software hurdle is nothing.

At least the device name is fitting.



No tone there? I swear there's some tone there. Without non-verbal communication our tone meters are known for false positives.

Ok the ROOFFI comment is pretty funny, I like subtle humor like that. There was no tone in this part, NPPL is the customer and is giving out the chips. The conversation was going towards how Virtue could put Tadao in to an unfavorable market position by raising the price on the chips it supplies to them. My point is that Virtue isn't supplying any chips to Tadao but to the NPPL.

[TonsOfFun]

Originally Posted by P0E

You feel people join this sport because of the tournament leagues. That's not only the minority view, most feel the opposite is true... even on PBN! Players burnt out on paintball typically do so after their tournament attempts hit a wall.

Economics is pretty cut and dry on the "if there's a market, there's someone to fill the need" thing. Tournaments have no effect on how expensive paint is, how many fields/brands there are or the diversity of products.

You do have a point. I do not think tournies are the ONLY basis of the economy and players, but they do account for some. You cannot say if the tourney circuit disappeared, that this sport would not drastically change.

I am just thinking, if we can stop cheating in any part of our sport, I think it is a good thing. Will this chip do that? Maybe, maybe not. We will not really know until this season. At least NPPL is trying new things to help the game. They are doing pump series, they are bringing millenium style play to the US. I for one commend them on trying to do SOMETHING to change it up. As for these chips we will see what the season brings, and I do hope they get the kinks worked out and it ends up helping the sport

[heinous]

well there are people complaining about this both here and in that pbn thread, not sure if catching on is a good term for this.

[P0E]

Originally Posted by Tugboater203

Ok the ROOFFI comment is pretty funny, I like subtle humor like that. There was no tone in this part, NPPL is the customer and is giving out the chips. The conversation was going towards how Virtue could put Tadao in to an unfavorable market position by raising the price on the chips it supplies to them. My point is that Virtue isn't supplying any chips to Tadao but to the NPPL.

Thank you. I'm really hoping that nick-name sticks.

The word "supplying" implies the item is free of charge. "Selling" might be more fitting.
Also, I don't think the NPPL is the customer. They are forcing every player to purchase seven via entry fees. Many teams have also stated they will be directly purchasing extra ROOFFIs just encase a gun goes down or to fill out the roster.
The tournament player is the only customer here. With the financial state of the NPPL you can't even argue they fronted the money to purchase the 'free' ones. Virtue either saw this as the perfect way to form a monopoly and gave the ROOFFIs to the NPPL free of charge... or they entered into an agreement to charge them X% of entry fees.

Integrated ROOFFIs are inevitable because there's so much obvious leverage and power Virtue could gain. The Smart Part patent is the perfect parallel. Can anyone offer a reason why they wouldn't start selling boards with this ROOFFI build-in?

Unless the NPPL is allowed to purchase all IP outright and source their own components/board assemblies (like government contracts).....or unless the NPPL allows other vendors to sell their own system (insecure & headaches).. This is simply the start of a coercive monopoly. ...which is why other people see the obvious problem for companies like Tadao.

P.S. Let me go on record here and say I recommended a barrel mounted, open source, league owned, passed out as needed, data logging, 'wired' system three years ago and still feel that type of system is the way to go in all tournament formats to keep them safe, fair, decrease entry fees, and eliminate the mandated electronic boards some leagues mandate.

[Ramous]

This is a very stupid way to solve a very simple problem. Instead of making all this tech or have people put unwanted **** in their guns how about they look at the real reason why people cheat? People cheat in pro paintball because it is worth it to them abd can secure them an easy win.

How about this? Make the penalties for cheating so extreme its no longer worth it for them to do so. If you are caught cheating, even once you are thrown out of the tournament. End of issues.