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Old 11-14-2012, 02:06 AM   #431 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by paintman161 View Post
Just checked this, my 13/3000 was filled to about 2800 psi, and got 165 shots at 270 fps. Dwell is at 14 still need to mess with it a little more to fine tune it.
Well that's like 3 mags more than my milsig did last year.
I can understand why people were hoping for better but that's still pretty decent.
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:07 AM   #432 (permalink)
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Oops double post
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:49 AM   #433 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by paintman161 View Post
Just checked this, my 13/3000 was filled to about 2800 psi, and got 165 shots at 270 fps. Dwell is at 14 still need to mess with it a little more to fine tune it.
That equates to nearly 1400 shots off a 68/45!

Odd that you're getting so much better efficiency than everyone else.

Is the gun that sensitive to dwell settings?

Is there a trade-off with consistency/efficiency/velocity?
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:13 PM   #434 (permalink)
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He's probably following the dwell setting procedure we offer in the manual or he already understands what the dwell does.

A higher dwell setting will make the gun more reliable. We factory set it to 20 so that it will work all around the world in all the different temps, humidity, elevations that people play in. But this does cost efficiency as the the solenoid is dumping air longer at a higher dwell. We recommend that advanced users adjust their dwell once they get it to their home region.

Keep in mind, a lower dwell will require more frequent lubing of the bolt system. If you lube the bolt after each day of use and after extended storage, you should be fine.
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:37 PM   #435 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by kevinatdye View Post
He's probably following the dwell setting procedure we offer in the manual or he already understands what the dwell does.

A higher dwell setting will make the gun more reliable. We factory set it to 20 so that it will work all around the world in all the different temps, humidity, elevations that people play in. But this does cost efficiency as the the solenoid is dumping air longer at a higher dwell. We recommend that advanced users adjust their dwell once they get it to their home region.

Keep in mind, a lower dwell will require more frequent lubing of the bolt system. If you lube the bolt after each day of use and after extended storage, you should be fine.
Are paintguy's numbers close to what you would expect at the top end?

So lowering the dwell increases efficiency at the cost of reliability. Could you elaborate on this and what we could expect?

- poor consistency?
- first shot drop off after relatively small temperature changes and short durations?
- bolt clips/chops, stuck bolts?
- damaged or prematurely worn components, etc etc??
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:01 PM   #436 (permalink)
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I'd say you can eek out a bit more then he has, but those are good numbers.

The dwell is literally the amount of time that the solenoid is activated.

The reliability will be in things like first shot drop off and bolt stick. You will not increase or decrease the wear to the bolt by adjusting the dwell. The reason you need more lube is because by lowering the dwell you are trying to get the bolt to cycle with less volume of air. Therefore less energy is available to the system. So the assembly must be thoroughly lubricated to minimize the friction caused by the o-rings.

So if that makes sense then you'll understand why you get the first shot drop off and the bolt stick. A low dwell just barely tips the system into cycling and a large dwell ensures complete bolt cycle even in bad conditions. Its like holding the handle down longer when you flush. Bad imagery? If you want to be more water efficiency, you cut back on the volume of water released into the cycle.

So this will not affect boll chop or barrel breaks or anything else. It really only affects air/power efficiency and bolt stick/first shot drop off.

The procedure we suggest is to set the dwell low then slowly raise it until the bolt cycles. Then load up and go chrono. Raise the dwell until you see no significant affect on the velocity. Once you are there you can usually drop it a point or two.

Please only do this if you are Very comfortable with the board and fully understand what the dwell is affecting. I can't tell you how many "broken" guns i have fixed by resetting a circuit board.
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Last edited by kevinatdye; 11-14-2012 at 05:06 PM.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:20 PM   #437 (permalink)
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I had a little knowledge of dwell but followed the dam manual, very well written and was able to get my dwell to 14, I also found this setting to be the most consistent with fps. I only use a small amount of lube, as too not gum anything up or get sticking issues. Wheni first air up the marker and shoot over the chrono I may get like a 150 fps reading but after that they are fine at 265-270 fps.

I cannot wait for the in stock option, already have 6 -20 rnd mags on there way. Which will be nice since I will be able to shoot all 7 mags on one tank.
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:13 PM   #438 (permalink)
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the hustle test was made with 300 fps if i remember good, it's quite normal to have more shots with only 270 fps.

In France, it's 265fps max on pro-fields, more shots a bit less distance.
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:20 PM   #439 (permalink)
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the hustle test was made with 300 fps if i remember good, it's quite normal to have more shots with only 270 fps.

In France, it's 265fps max on pro-fields, more shots a bit less distance.
Not too mention they were using full auto, which will reduce your air quite a bit.
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:00 PM   #440 (permalink)
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Not too mention they were using full auto, which will reduce your air quite a bit.
They say it's 280-290. Not sure if that would account for a 50% gain in efficiency. Why would 'full auto' decrease efficiency?
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