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Old 04-15-2013, 05:34 AM   #41 (permalink)
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New record result of my Kingmann New Hammer - after experiments with powertube, valve nut and cup seal modifications, different hammer weight and valve springs - I was able get with the best setup total 469 Joules in 50 usable shoots. First 47 shoots were pretty consistent (avelerage velocity 257 fps) and all safely below 300 fps.



Even when the conditions of test were not optimal for "record hunting", it looks be now the second best known result where are all shoots safely below 300 fps... I was really suprised that the miserable New Hammer with small powertube ID and without reg can be so good... Im hoping for even better results after planed changes on bolt.


Marker details:
- custom stainless steel barrel, ID 17,35-17,40mm (.684"), lenght 9.25"
- custom "CCI Detent ring" ID 17,3mm (.681")
- stock brass hammer lightened from ~50g to 23g
- stock hammer spring, strenght in setup 4 Kg
- valve spring replaced for long black conical Spyder valve spring from 32 Spyder spring set, strenght in setup 2,2-3,2 Kg (oppening force - full opened)
- stock powertube (ID 4,0mm = .157") with input holes modified along WGP Ranger powertube (~ = roundet edges)
- stock valve nut with removed some threads near cup seal sealing face - along know Tigershark mod
- stock cup seal replaced for homemade PTFE cup seal - softer, shorter and with rounded edges on side to valve chamber
- stock BE Q-changer in common back-bottle ASA
- no regulator
- no changes for limitation of expansion/flow in the valve chamber


Conditions of the tests:

Ambient temperature: 13C

Time between shoots: 3-4 seconds (marker is now without any mag - loadet per one ball, with hand)

Real fill of powerlet: 11g
(along the measurement of unused and used powerlet weight... Im using only common digital kitchen weight)

Paint: RPS Evil, one year old.

Paint weight: weight of set of 50 used paintballs was 161g, so avelerage weight of one ball should be 3,22g (but for the KE calculation has been used common weight 3,20g like in other cases).

Paint dimensions: between 17,0-17,6mm (.677-0,693") but mostly 17,2-17,5mm (0,673-0,689"). Every second ball was visibly not round (not surprise after year of stroraging), some have different diameter around seam, on few are visible small flat surfaces...


BTW: with the "same marker" I have performed 10 chrono-test with following small modifications in recent two weeks, more than 350 shoots were fired. Imho it was proven that differences in temperatures (+2C => +12C), real powerlet fill (10-12g) and paint weight (3.20-3.35g), having really only very small effects on performance... at least in comparsion with "small changes" on the marker (for exception change of the hammer weight for 1g (1/28 oz) or spring force for 0,2 Kg ( 0,4 lb) or air channel diameter for 0,2mm (.008") can affect the marker performance really dramatically, sometimes). Imho until you can get more than ~450 Joules from your marker, there is no real reason to mess with such like "scientific" variables like temperature, humidity, powerlet will, paint weight - these variables simply affecting efficiency not so, how he is harmed by common marker flaws...
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:35 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manning View Post
I got a lot more numbers for you to look at including some pretty nice total shots (not at field velocities) but the counts are nice.

VKC Duck #51 tuning thread
Great!

Edited:

Perhaps the best Mannings result up to 27.4.2013:

Total 375 Joules:


Last edited by 3022; 04-29-2013 at 06:14 AM.
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:41 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Here's some data.

CCI Phantom with ASP Roundhead body (takes cocker barrels) and a 14" Lapco Sniper barrel (.681 bore.) Stock CCI internals, silver mainspring/silver valve spring.

GI Sports 4-Star, fresh, round nice balls at about .682-.684 based on Freak bore sizers.

About 15-30 between shots, long enough to walk over to a table and write a number down; longer between every 10 shots to reload. Nice spring day, outside temp about 70* F. Low humididty.

Shots
1. 281
2. 277
3. no data from chrono. Operator error maybe?
4. 280
5. no data
6. 283
7. 274
8. 283
9. 282
10. 283
11. 275
12. 277
13. no data
14. 281
15. 281
16. 280
17. 275
18. 280
19. 281
20. 283
21. 276
22. 278
23. 290 (!)
24. 284
25. 278
26. 285
27. no data
28. 276
29. 285
30. 275
31. 284
32. 278
33. 272
34. 281
35. 278
36. 275
37. 268
38. 270
39. 251
40. 230
No further shots...that's all I had.

According to Excel, that's an average of 276.9 FPS, over 36 shots, not counting missing data. Sorry I don't know how to insert an Excel chart into MCB, but I find these numbers pretty nice ,in term of consistency and number of usable shot. I could have probable turned down the initial FPS, and gotten more, but these numbers seem pretty respectable to me.

Thoughts?
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Old 04-29-2013, 05:56 AM   #44 (permalink)
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PB Weasel Redux ( VKC Duck #51 tuning thread

Total 471 Joules... and 447 Joules in 235-400 fps range. It is 4. best know results in EK/12g efficiency and the second best where are all shoots safely below 300 fps...

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Old 04-29-2013, 06:05 AM   #45 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mootho View Post
Here's some data.

...

According to Excel, that's an average of 276.9 FPS, over 36 shots, not counting missing data. Sorry I don't know how to insert an Excel chart into MCB, but I find these numbers pretty nice ,in term of consistency and number of usable shot. I could have probable turned down the initial FPS, and gotten more, but these numbers seem pretty respectable to me.

Thoughts?

With replacement of the no-reads values with the lower near them it gives me ~442 J/12g. Imho it is very, very good... but not the best. The top values look be now around 470 J/12g... but the difference is generally small - 30 J are ~3 full power shoots.

I will put your values in Excel table and make the graph later. Anyway thank you for the input.

Edited 30.4.2013:

But in the graph it looks more impressive - great consistency on relatively high velocity.


Last edited by 3022; 04-30-2013 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 04-29-2013, 10:17 AM   #46 (permalink)
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This looks be Manning Duck best record (Today data):



- 472 J in shoots above 150 fps, 433 J in 235-300 fps range.
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Old 05-05-2013, 09:16 PM   #47 (permalink)
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My Micro Phantom results, following CJOttowa's recomendations from this thread [URL="http://www.mcarterbrown.com/forums/redux/134391-powertubes-short-barrel-guns.html"]

Micro Phantom, 6" Freak bored CCI barrel with brass .678 sizer (thanks Ty Mcneer!); crappy JT paint from K-mart (ovoid, and dimpled as you can imagine); ported TPC, #6 power tube, red main spring, fluted hammer, silver valve spring; about 15 sec between shots (long enough to put it down and write a number) with longer times between each 10 rds to reload; Leland 12ies

1. 289
2. 272
3. 269
4. 262
5. 262
6. 262
7. 255
8. 260
9. 264
10. 247
11. 258
12. 260
13. 255
14. 266
15. 235
16. 255
17. 263
18. 243
19. 263
20. 254
21. 258
22. 252
23. 258
24. 257
25. 259
26. 259
27. 251
28. 258
29. 263
30. 252
31. 263
32. 262
33. 261
34. 275
35. 253
36. 259
37. 256
38. 243
39. 244
40. 225
41. 225
42. 194
43. 171
44. 159
45. no reading
46. no reading
47. no reading
48. vented
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Old 05-05-2013, 11:07 PM   #48 (permalink)
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I think you should be including height above sea level (atmospheric pressure) in the readings. Normalize them to 0m for comparisons.
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Old 05-06-2013, 05:25 AM   #49 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mootho View Post
My Micro Phantom results...
Ʃ 403 J/12g and 375 J in 235-300 fps range.
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Old 05-06-2013, 05:38 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neftaly View Post
I think you should be including height above sea level (atmospheric pressure) in the readings. Normalize them to 0m for comparisons.
95% of the population lives in altitudes below 4000 meters (Hypsographic demography: The distribution of human population by altitude) and the difference between 0 and 4000 meters is only 40 kPa = 5.8 psi (Air Pressure and Altitude above Sea Level).

So the differences caused by the altitude/atmospheric pressure are so small, that he plays no role. A little bigger effect can be perhaps on range, but not on muzzle velocity.
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