Paintball

[splattttttt]

Originally Posted by cjottawa

Have Dremel, will test.

Where would you put the ramp, Splattttttt?

On that tray. Right behind the ball.
I'm sure that's where it hangs up. Having a ramp, will also help feed faster.


PBweasel doesn't think you should mutilate the gun though.

[CJOttawa]

Originally Posted by splattttttt

On that tray. Right behind the ball.
I'm sure that's where it hangs up. Having a ramp, will also help feed faster.

http://www.mcarterbrown.com/forums/a...dux_snub-8-jpg
PBweasel doesn't think you should mutilate the gun though.

IronChef97's photo of a Loo Duck, copied below, supports your solution. Note the large opening behind the port - sort of a "tray" where the second paint ball can "get out of the way".

Originally Posted by ironchef97

...**One last interesting thing to note is that original kamikaze shooters with welded feedtubes have their feedtubes spaced somewhat inbetween Carter ducks and Reduxes...BUT if you look closely, there is a small slot on Loo's duck, where balls can drop down to the body level sooner.
I have no idea whether this is a unique thing, or if all the original 'shooters had this 'enlarged' feed port...

[CJOttawa]

Based on Splattttttt's analysis of the problem, I agree one of the problems is the BACK of the feed block pushing the second ball into the front edge of the snub feed port.

Prior to milling the slide, I think there's a less drastic test to try: milling the feed block and feed tube adaptor to add a "ramp" behind the ball.

If this contacts the ball below its midpoint, it might pop it back up and out of the breech.

See this photo:


___________________________

Failing the above, this is the drastic option of putting the whole feed tube closer to the snub.

Here are photos I took with a digital caliper in view.

There's a 0.300 inch gap between where the feed tube is and where it could easily be moved. It COULD be moved tighter than that but it would involve welding; I'm stick with 0.300 for the first test.

The feed tube is 0.875 inches in diameter. I assume this means I'd need a 0.875 ball end mill to put the concave trough in the slide. I'll deal with the front feed block after the feed tube's been dealt with. See photos below for details.

I had a thread discussing milling the slide; I'm resurrecting that idea. That thread is here: milling the slide for tighter feed tube spacing

[dm6rocker]

Originally Posted by DSA

cJ have you ever played with a DD68 or Carter Duck? I think you will find some of the same issues associated in this thread.

I can vouch for that. I have a Carterized Loo Duck, and I still get pinching issues from time to time. It may not be as bad as what you guys are experiencing due to the way the feed tube is on mine, but I still get them.

Mine does not have the ramp in the feed that Mr. Loo's does. Here's a pic.


I think what's going on in Loo's feed tube may be the best bet, sort of a ramp system like what CJ described in his last post.

[WickedKlown2]

CJ,,,

Here are the pics of the DuckSlide I promised earlier... I think that you might be on the right path with putting a ramp on the back half of your feed block and feed tube... You will notice in my pics that the back part of the ball drop is ramped... I also do not use a return spring and can feel when something is not right and it stops me from pinching a ball... Most of the paint in the south east region has been running small as well and I only use premium paints when I play big games (i.e. Valken Redemption, RPS Premium, Ultra Evil, RPS Marballizer) outlaw games I have been using Procaps Visible Impact Pro or the left over big game paint...

DuckSlide in the closed position with the rear to the left side of pic


DuckSlide open position with 2 balls (one in chamber and one sitting on top),,, left side of pic is still rear

another view of 2 ball stack with left side of pic to the rear


Looking down in the chamber with one ball,,, left side of pic is the rear


I hope this somewhat helps...

WK2

[CJOttawa]

Originally Posted by short304

Did you ever get pics of this??? like CJ I too would love to see... of coarse, I haven't even held my dux yet, but reading through this thread has peaked me interest in the possible solutions...

A "detent" won't work in the Redux. A detent only works in guns where the first ball in the chamber is rolling forward; on the Redux it isn't. The second ball sits directly on TOP of the first and STILL gets chopped.

The solution is going to be either a "shelf" (quasi-bore drop conversion) or milling the feed block with a ramp, as Splattttttt and WK2 suggested above. Working on that now - similar design to the DuckSlide.

Originally Posted by splattttttt

CJ, I got to play with PBweasel's Redux a few days ago.
He showed me a trick.

Apparently, with the gun tilted down slightly, a single round will place it self in that tray and will stay in place even when the gun is tilted back allowing the remaining paint to move away from the feed port.
Tilting it back, will allow you to pump and load the ball into the breech, while the rest of the other balls are safely in the stick feed.

Doing this, I had no trouble with pinching.

You just described how I pump my Redux.

[CJOttawa]

Problem solved.

See first post: http://www.mcarterbrown.com/forums/r...ml#post1313175

Originally Posted by DSA

I hope I works for you Cj.... Yikes, that was kinda like adding bondo to a door ding on a Delorean....

My intent is to have the rear feed block bolt hole welded closed and re-tap about 3/4-inch farther back. That's cosmetic though. The gun finally loads like it should.

*** *** ***

I just noticed in one of the photos:

"PMI 3" was calling me while I took that photo.

[Canuck]

^^^ I cried a little...

Seriously though, we spent a great deal of time analyzing the problem and it all boiled down to the fact that the second ball was being forced forward from well above its centre line. On the Duckslide the second ball is basically "scooped" up/out when the slide is pushed forward - on the Redux it is effectively hit by an anvil...

Props to CJ for having the intestinal fortitude to carry out this modification.

Edit: I suppose that you can return the milling cutters now...

[CJOttawa]

Next up: brazing the now unused bolt hole on the feed block for cosmetic purposes.

I'm leaning toward HTS-2000.
http://www.aluminumrepair.com/video_new.asp

Check the video and the website. Melting point is 500°F lower than aluminum (they demo work on a pop can in the video) and it can be anodized. This seems ideal.

Originally Posted by dm6rocker

Man. Props to you for taking that leap. I'd be hard pressed to EVER go near a redux with powertools like that.

Good to hear that it works, you should get some video for us!

Originally Posted by Tbuck

Wow...now that is definitely taking function over form to a new level!

Originally Posted by WickedKlown2

CJ,,,

Glad to hear it worked out for you ,,, I was hoping that would be it and not something else as you already went that far to ramp the feed block and slide body...

Have a good one and please keep us posted on how the mod is working out on the field

WK2

Originally Posted by DSA

Balls... Wow big hairy Canadian balls!

Originally Posted by short304

To quote one of my favorite Will Ferrel movies - "He actually did it!"... good stuff CJ, although I'm not sure I'll have the 'cojones' to do this myself... guess we'll have to wait and see!

Originally Posted by PB Weasel

NIce work CJ, I will admit the thought of modding my dux in this manner makes me cringe, but you did it, and quit well at that. hope it helps to solve the ball pinches you were experiencing.

Originally Posted by dundadun

and here arrives a new problem...running out of paint and air too fast.

You got it, gentlemen.

Redux 043 no longer suffers from the design's critical flaw. Machining the slide and block was a calculated risk, as you alluded to WK2. Fortunately it paid off.

Originally Posted by PMI 3

^^^ I cried a little...

Seriously though, we spent a great deal of time analyzing the problem and it all boiled down to the fact that the second ball was being forced forward from well above its centre line. On the Duckslide the second ball is basically "scooped" up/out when the slide is pushed forward - on the Redux it is effectively hit by an anvil...

Props to CJ for having the intestinal fortitude to carry out this modification.

Edit: I suppose that you can return the milling cutters now...

Mar and I gave the Redux a workout today. Neither of us could get it to pinch, in the 30 paintballs we ran through it.

The second ball popped up, "scooped" as PMI 3 put it.

[DSA]

Originally Posted by cjottawa

Next up: brazing the now unused bolt hole on the feed block for cosmetic purposes.

Please take this to a qualified machinist before you melt it down I mean that in the best way possible and not to offend, because cosmetically it's already FUBAR.

I still don't understand why you didn't order an unfinished feed tube block from the Redux Factory to hack up or ask Steve if he had any blem slides to put theory to test. This kind of reminds me of the after thought slam changers out there, you can still see the knob threads inside the grip frame. Although very cool they are very ghetto which however was appropriate for that era not this one....Still you have nads, me I just "learned" to pump the gun properly which wasn't too hard to master.

Maybe you can hide the damage by just cutting down the screw and throwing in some "Mighty Putty" or epoxy to retain it.