mcarterbrown.com  

VM Empire Where the VM-68's and PMI-3 Come out to play

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-28-2014, 01:37 AM   #1 (permalink)
Paint magnet
 
Atomicvole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011

Brass N Wood Fan
Palmers Fan
Psiworx remote to regulator or expansion chamber

New to VM68.
Don't know WHY I need to have such a machine but I do.

Would like to run HPA and have read varying views about doing this.

Have also read varying views on expansion chamber or regulator, for either CO2 or HPA.

In the readings an expansion chamber like a Taso vaporizor(?) with the large single chamber seems to be most versitile, allowing volume for HPA use as well as plenty of room for gassious expansion in the cse of CO2.

Existing setup is a Ninja 4500/90 pro tank with Psiworx remote line on a BT Mercinary Molle vest.
__________________
McCarter Brown Feedback
Atomicvole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 02:28 AM   #2 (permalink)
Rec Poster
 
Mugged2Much's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Sweden.

On HPA, I'd rather run a high-flowing reg than an expansion chamber - but I'm unsure of any actual benefits, since the marker prefers high pressure to begin with, and your tank output is already regulated.

I doubt you'd see any benefit at all of having an external air chamber without modifying the gun internally. The bottleneck is the air passage from the ASA up to the valve chamber, and then from the valve to the bolt (on older guns at least).

Your greatest enemy in running the gun on HPA will be resistance from the mechanism. You have a super-heavy hammer and a bolt with four o-rings (often swollen and hardened). Replacing the rear two o-rings of the bolt and removing the front two ones can make a huge difference if you're trying to combat cycling problems.

Just get the gun first, try it out and see where you stand. Good luck!
__________________
Paintball Nostalgia Blog

Areas of special interest:
|:| Autocockers |:| VM-68 |:| Sterling |:| Phantom |:|
Mugged2Much is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 12:54 PM   #3 (permalink)
random probability waves
 
Bored383's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sandy Eggo by way of Mobtown

Brass N Wood Fan
run it on CO2

I've made VM's work well on HPA . . . but I can make them work just as well on CO2 with a lot less effort
__________________
Quote:
DSA: You know you were a kept kid if you jacked off to Frazetta barbarian babes!
There I was sword in hand!
TANSTAAFL

Quote:
Originally Posted by stimpy
here's your chance to be cool like Don
Quote:
Originally Posted by stimpy
don is on the path to everlasting coolness
Quote:
Originally Posted by DashHopes
OMG boobs, beers and Chad Thompson. Nothing could be better.
Bored383 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 03:54 PM   #4 (permalink)
Paint magnet
 
Atomicvole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011

Brass N Wood Fan
Palmers Fan
mmm Co2, yeah pretty much why I was considering a VM68. For those days one end up at a field where the Co2 is good and the HPA is iffy.

now I can go back to plotting this ground assault cannon.

Thank you.
__________________
McCarter Brown Feedback
Atomicvole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 04:53 PM   #5 (permalink)
random probability waves
 
Bored383's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sandy Eggo by way of Mobtown

Brass N Wood Fan
also - for CO2 usage . . . in my experience . . . you need a big single or dual stage expansion chamber, and then a vertical tank setup for max consistency.
Vert tank is not necessary, but nice. one of my VM's is an old air america terrorist - BIG expansion chamber and a back bottle. It took heavy fire in cold weather to ever make it snow out the barrel. a custom vert tank setup on it eliminated that, but it was rarely an issue.

my basic suggestions for VM's are to toss the valve spring - really, you don't need it, then take the valve out and bore out the smallest transfer port as large as possible. run that port only. then dial in the velocity via barrel lengths and adjusting the choke in the bolt.

on my beater VM I usually chrono all the shots within 10fps with decent paint. Not bad for an old CO2 powered beast.

here it is, was shooting ~280fps in this vid, running valken graffitti

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gROdm8SCBIU

good luck and have fun!
__________________
Quote:
DSA: You know you were a kept kid if you jacked off to Frazetta barbarian babes!
There I was sword in hand!
TANSTAAFL

Quote:
Originally Posted by stimpy
here's your chance to be cool like Don
Quote:
Originally Posted by stimpy
don is on the path to everlasting coolness
Quote:
Originally Posted by DashHopes
OMG boobs, beers and Chad Thompson. Nothing could be better.
Bored383 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 05:43 PM   #6 (permalink)
Rec Poster
 
Mugged2Much's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Sweden.

If you can get hold of CO2 cheaply, that does sound like a good plan (where I live, CO2 fills are a lot more expensive since almost nobody uses it anymore - even rental guns run on HPA here).

For CO2, I'd suggest either an expansion chamber or a Palmer's Stabilizer. Preferrably both, with the reg after the expansion chamber. I used to run mine on remote instead. You get an anti-siphon effect by doing that (almost as good as running a vertical tank, or a dedicated anti-siphon tank). The idea is to get any liquid CO2 to boil off before getting into the gun. Also, by placing the tank on a remote you take a lot of weight off an already heavy gun.

I think that gasseous CO2 (as described above) is the way to go in 95% of all cases. While I've heard of people claiming to run their VMs on pure liquid CO2 in winter with good success, I haven't been lucky with that myself - in any gun, come to think of it. I don't know if it's too cold where I live, or too humid, but during rapid fire on liquid the gun will get so cold that it turns into a block of ice. The cup seal freezes and starts to leak. The colder the gun gets, the more the pressure inside it will drop. Once it gets down far enough, blowback semis won't cycle properly (and the VM is particularly finicky about pressure) - and in Nelson pumps the valve spring can't keep the valve shut on its own, causing each pump stroke to send blasts of snow through the gun. I've witnessed a guy blow the hopper off his gun by doing that. The cool thing about liquid are the plumes of smoke exiting the barrel with each shot.
__________________
Paintball Nostalgia Blog

Areas of special interest:
|:| Autocockers |:| VM-68 |:| Sterling |:| Phantom |:|
Mugged2Much is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 12:01 AM   #7 (permalink)
Paint magnet
 
Atomicvole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011

Brass N Wood Fan
Palmers Fan
The one field that I don't like getting HPA at actually includes Co2 fill in the field fee.

Probably get a 20oz tank should suit my needs...?
Any one brand better than another, they seem pretty straight forward.

Bored, I LOVE THAT VIDEO.
Been watching it over and over since Bacci posted it.
__________________
McCarter Brown Feedback
Atomicvole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 03:40 AM   #8 (permalink)
Rec Poster
 
Mugged2Much's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Sweden.

Yeah, the VM is a gas hog, so I would recommend a 20 oz. Minimum for me would be 12 oz.
If you can, get a tank with a built in on/off valve. That saves you both trouble and o-rings.
__________________
Paintball Nostalgia Blog

Areas of special interest:
|:| Autocockers |:| VM-68 |:| Sterling |:| Phantom |:|
Mugged2Much is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2014, 01:36 PM   #9 (permalink)
Paint magnet
 
Atomicvole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011

Brass N Wood Fan
Palmers Fan
On/ff valve for the tank, even if using a remote line?
__________________
McCarter Brown Feedback
Atomicvole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2014, 04:01 PM   #10 (permalink)
Rec Poster
 
Mugged2Much's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Sweden.

Depends on whether you have a working on/off on the remote or not.
__________________
Paintball Nostalgia Blog

Areas of special interest:
|:| Autocockers |:| VM-68 |:| Sterling |:| Phantom |:|
Mugged2Much is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  mcarterbrown.com » Paintball » The Armory » VM Empire

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO
© MCB Network LLC