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Old 04-27-2007, 09:49 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Please list some causes of chopping....

... at or around the feedneck.

I've got a cocker that has been chopping badly. The first time I thought it was due to a hit in the hopper. The second time it happened it was definetly on it's own but MAY have been from me short stroking. The third time happened while test firing at a slow rate in my shop. On this last case I can definetly say that it was not from short stroking. Something would appear to be making the balls hang up or break in the breech when fired.

And this was using paint that I had zero problems with in another cocker and in one of my Piranhas. So it may be the paint but not as commonly as this thing is breaking them.

The feedneck is full of goo so I'm guessing that it's not letting the balls fall down all the way. And I tend to hold the trigger back for a bit so again, it was definetly not me in this last shop test.

There's nothing that I can feel for sure other than a very slight sharp edge along the lower end of the feedneck.

It's a PB Superbolt converted to single trigger. The LPR and cocking rod is currently set so that the end of the bolt is just a hair behind the back edge of the feedneck when the trigger is held back.
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Old 04-27-2007, 10:04 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Railgun View Post
The LPR and cocking rod is currently set so that the end of the bolt is just a hair behind the back edge of the feedneck when the trigger is held back.
Thats where I put the bolt with the gun degassed. Try (without air) pulling the block back untill the hammer catches, and let the block rest there. Im guessing that you will have some bolt sticking into the breech. It seems that every airsmith and shadetree cocker mechanic had a different way to time a cocker... but I like mine so that the bolt clears the breech the same time as the hammer latches, give or take some for a performance tune. the rest after that is ram "over travel" and that can be minimized by screwing in the back block so that the ram only pushes the bolt 1/8-1/4 of an inch past the hammer latching point. good luck, hopefully this helps. I do most of my timing with the gun degassed, makes it easier to fine tune.
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Old 04-27-2007, 10:05 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Hm, nevermind I see now that you've got the bolt set properly...
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Old 04-27-2007, 10:38 PM   #4 (permalink)
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If the bolt is set too far back, you can get the ball rolling a little backwards and letting the ball on top of it drop down a hair, and then that top ball gets chopped when the bolt comes forward.

Also, try putting just a stack of paintballs in the feedneck with no hopper, or a 10 round tube vertically as a hopper and see if the balls are popcorning up the stack as you fire.
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Old 04-27-2007, 11:46 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantom Power View Post
If the bolt is set too far back, you can get the ball rolling a little backwards and letting the ball on top of it drop down a hair, and then that top ball gets chopped when the bolt comes forward.

Also, try putting just a stack of paintballs in the feedneck with no hopper, or a 10 round tube vertically as a hopper and see if the balls are popcorning up the stack as you fire.
When I said the bolt sits back by just a hair when air'ed up and with the trigger pulled I wasn't kidding. It's just barely enough to feel. Still that's a good point to check about the ball stack. I'll try that. It's consistent with the fact that the goo from the chopped balls is up in the feedneck.

There's no reall blowback at all. In my shop check I was using the BE Pocket Hopper which is all clear and there was no evidence of popcorning at all. Just 10'ish good shots and then soup out of the blue.
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Old 04-28-2007, 12:19 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Could be a bad detent or oversized barrel allowing the loaded ball to roll forward.
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Old 04-28-2007, 02:15 AM   #7 (permalink)
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OK, I played with this a little more tonight. I noticed that the System X I played with a lot last week and didn't chop a single ball has the bolt running a fair bit back behind the opening (that's the way it came). Now I know this isn't supposed to be "right" but you can't argue with success. So following along with that I set up the Chopper to have a little more travel as well. That ALMOST did the trick. It chopped at around ball 20 or so.

So I swapped for a barrel that didn't have my patent pending wire detent mod and shot off about 30 more and no chops. From there I fine tuned (bent) my wire barrel detent to protude a lot less but still catch the ball to prevent rollouts. That did the trick.

I'd been wondering about this for a while now and I've got some teflon tubing coming that'll fit the .032 wire nicely. I figure with a little less protrusion into the barrel combined with the teflon my autococker barrel detent mod will be a true winner.

That and the little extra travel time that the longer bolt back travel offers seems to provide the balls more time to fall down.

Hopefully this will do the trick.

The regular detents were checked and operating nicely. Good point though Crash.

I really need to make up a shielded target for this testing. I've got a foot and a half wide bit of old chip board stuck in my garbage can and I've been shooting low to keep the splatter down but the floor and one of my motorcycles is a MESS now.... and I'm about 200 balls poorer...
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Old 04-29-2007, 12:02 AM   #8 (permalink)
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IT'S BAAAAAAAAAck....

Tried playing with the black PB today that seemed so promising in the shop the other night. No go. About ball 10 it chopped and that was it. I swabbed and it chopped again. Swabbed again and it was shooting balls with paths like a boomerang.

As mentioned above this is a Psycho Ballistics Superbolt. I've got two of them. I played with the other one and it shot darts for the two games I used it in and in a third game when I lent it to someone with a broken gun. Not a single chop.


Both guns are set the same on the bolt travel and both use the stock PB ram. The blue one uses an Orracle Tickler LPR and an ANS 3way. The Chopper uses a Palmer SDT LPR and a Dye 3way. The only difference that I'll have to play with is that the black one was using a Lapco barrel that was a slight pinch on the paint but I could still blow it through easily and the blue the old "wide as an overpass" PB barrel. Both also used the newly tuned wire barrel detents coated with a slip on of small teflon tubing.

I'm now officially stumped other than trying the black one with the oversized PB barrel.....

.... Anyone got a .690 cocker barrel for sale? Whatever happened to the idea that a pinch fit is the right fit? Sure doesn't seem to be working for me at all.
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Old 04-29-2007, 02:52 AM   #9 (permalink)
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A little extra info. I just finished cleaning out the Lapco Autospirit barrel that I used on the black Superbolt. I tested the paint and about 1/3 to 1/2 of the balls rolled out and the others required a slight puff to push on through.
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Old 04-29-2007, 03:19 AM   #10 (permalink)
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go to moodypaintball.com . There are tech articles on there that show how to set up your cocker correctly as well as an article specifically about the cocking rod. I was having the same problems as you are having now and after setting up my cocker according to that guide I have never had a problem with chopping. You might also want to invest in a spring kit if you already haven't .

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