Freak vs Freak XL in a short barrel

[pintbuster]

I like short barrels, and my plan is to have a bull barrel bored out and cut down to just past my shroud using my standard 5 inch freak kits.
If I go to an 8 inch XL, I would pick up almost 40% more control bore for only an additional 3/4 inch in length than what I have now.
I assume this would help with consistency in velocity? The price isn't an issue, but I don't want to spend it for no real gains.

[pintbuster]

Picture for clarification

[Hellion360]

My experience is anecdotal, but I have not noticed a difference.

[BrendanB]

I would buy a nummech XL barrel back extender. Just use as needed. Makes any freak cocker barrel an XL

[OpusX]

So for short freaked barrels I have; a Doc Tanto (standard freak, 8" total), stock emek bored for XL (10" total). Both are about as short as you can get, with the emek barrel being nearly all insert right up to the ports. If I switch between them on the same marker and re-chrono, with the same sized insert and paint, there tends to be a small (2-5 fps) change up/down between freak and XL, with XL being the up swing.

It isn't anything serious enough to be concerned with, but I personally enjoy as much control bore as I can get, but sometimes I just want as short as can be as well. The easy answer is get both.

[BrendanB]

Here is my midget halfback, you can see the stubby freak bored barrel in one pic, and the stubby barrel with XL freak adapter added to back.

[latches109]

great build! I like the ccm 3way, gives it the stubby feel. who did the anodizing?

[pintbuster]

Thanks for the info guys. Bad paint out of my short barrel seemed to be drastically worse than other longer barrels last weekend.
I will do a little more research before I start cutting

[Roger7pball]

Doesn’t help with your question but ran a normal freak with a small Doc tip, was quite consistent and accurate. Quieter than expected too.

https://www.reddit.com/r/paintball/comments/nd305a/short_saturday/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

[Brokeass_baller]

The great Tom Kaye says with nitrogen, that an 8" control bore is all that is required to accelerate the ball to 300fps. Anything more only creates drag. Anything less, and you'll need to increase the operating pressure to compensate. (Source: Tom's Tech Tips articles on AO)

Now, Bud Orr says only 4-6" of control bore is required for CO2 due to the liquid vapor expansion. (Source: Bud Orr orally via The Popular Unknown Podcast, ep17.)

So let's assume you run HPA and normally chrono your markers at 280. That's a common velocity. I did the math and essentially, you need 0.0267" (0.026 repeated) of control bore per foot per second desired. So multiply that by 280fps, and you get a necessary control bore of 7.267" (7.26 repeated).

Since Mr. Orr gives a mild range variation for control bore, let's assume 6" will get you to 300fps on CO2. This will give you a nice clean 0.02" of control bore per foot per second of desired muzzle velocity. So at 280fps, you only need 5.6" of control bore.

So basically, no matter which propellant you run, the difference is fairly negligible. I upgraded to XL's in 2018 (when I got back into paintball after a 7yr hiatus) simply because I'm an Automag fanboy and TK cultist. Lol. But you *should* see better efficiency with XL inserts, but nothing drastic.

I do not know of any other similar researches done about control bore vs velocity. So I'm taking their word as fact.

[rathbaster]

Science! (more or less) and references.
I like it.

I was going to add this same info when I saw your post.

As I recall there were some research-tests done by people when the XL's came out and they found a small increase in efficiency over the standard 5" freak inserts.

[Brokeass_baller]

I remember seeing a couple YouTube videos where the two were tested, and most only showed a 5 or 6fps average increase in velocity when using the XLs. I also remember seeing one that showed a crazy increase, like 15fps or something. I have always assumed that was just marketing.

[Chuck E Ducky]

I didn’t notice any real difference between the Standard and XL. Definitely not enough to warrant switching if you already have a good kit. I just didn’t see much of a difference with it. Maybe over the chrono you might. To me it was just a way to sell new barrels and inserts. But if your going to run a super short barrel I would take everything you can get.

Consistency comes from the paint more then the barrel. If there is a difference paint today isn’t good enough to take advantage of it IMO.

I do notice a difference with one piece barrels vs insert / 2 piece. I’m definitely getting more bore options if PumpPB dose another run of Lapco Tightsticks. I want a full set of them.

I think since your making the barrel and are buying the insert to fit it might as well go with the XL.