Old TPX - does Tippmann (Kore) still offer upgraded internals?

[EvilCreature]

I thought mech ions were not really sensitive because of the extra oring in the tail that cuts the air supply off?

[lhamilton1807]

They went through the entire thing and seemingly replaced every oring and also swapped out the barrel adapter block, some springs, cup seals, valve puncture assembly, valve assembly, and regulator assembly. All for just the price of shipping.

This kind of service for an ancient TPX that’s way out of warranty is pretty spectacular.

[The Inflicted]

Yep! It's either off an X-7 or a late-model A5. Nice and quiet for $5 off eBay.

[lhamilton1807]

That looks like a stock A5 barrel. I tried one out on my tpx yesterday and was stoked that it fit so well.

[The Inflicted]

Love my tipx. Loud as a mother but fun as hell to see people turn heads.

That's the weirdest Micromag I've ever seen.

And here I thought I was being clever with my gas setup: https://i.postimg.cc/Pr3Jjk00/120112...86045060-n.jpg

[lhamilton1807]

So back to the original topic.

Tippmann won’t send out the parts anymore but if you ship it to them, they’ll install the updated parts and ship it back for free. Not bad! I was hoping to keep the old parts for modding, but this is still great service.

[Cunha]

Woah that’s sick

[Brokeass_baller]

It still runs through the frame. I cut off the bottom o-ring of the air tube, made an adapter block, and drilled an air hole and o-ring spot on the CP ASA like they do for sleeper pneumags. The thing sits a little forward because of the way the air has to line up, but it's pretty comfortable.

[Trbo323]

AGD did do it better. But... Things can be done about that ASA, which I agree, is terrible. I hate the angle of it with a 68ci.

Is that a block off plate you have there or is it running as a transfer up through the frame still?

Does the tippmann flex valve get terrible efficiency like the automag or is it better?

If classic mags were efficient, they would be higher on my list of guns. They’re already very high because of how accurate they feel for me.

I never really paid that close of attention when I had mine but I got the impression it was still in the ballpark of the mag

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[Cunha]

Does the tippmann flex valve get terrible efficiency like the automag or is it better?

If classic mags were efficient, they would be higher on my list of guns. They’re already very high because of how accurate they feel for me.

[Trbo323]

First, I had a massive brain fart, you are correct about the inline blowback. Somehow my sleep deprived brain mixed up spyder with the stbb and tippmanns inline blowback

The original Geo came out in 08 or 09 about; the same time as the TPX (the first iteration of the flex Valve). The Gamma Core came out in 2016 with the original Gtek - well after the Phenom and Crossover. I don't know if the previous PE bolt systems were dwell insensitive or not, but it definitely wasn't accomplished the same way with the sprung spool.

Secondly, I'm ignoring the rest of it, we are just going to disagree anyway, but this part above is the part that doesn't make sense

In some little Google searches

Geo 2008
Flex valve 2009
Geo 2 2010

The geo 2 is the first case of pe using a moving central spool. So for pe to get the idea from tippmann that means they would have had to get the idea from tippmann, design, R&D, market actually produce and release for sale in 1 year.

That also means between 08 and 09 pe was not working on improving the geo platform at all unless they had some kind of spy inside tippmann



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[Dauntless152]

Love my tipx. Loud as a mother but fun as hell to see people turn heads.

[Brokeass_baller]

Yes, same basic design but I don't think parts are interchangeable, it's all based around a modified automag valve.

The problem is, agd did it better. I owned a crossover for a while and I was convinced it was going to be my "poor man's e mag" but it just left me wanting so much that I eventually sold it. Maybe if I didn't already own an automag I'd have felt better about it but just everything about it, the trigger felt sloppy, programming the board is a nightmare, I couldn't relocate the ASA because tippmann basically dropped all support for them (wanted a drop forward) feedneck was Ehh. The only way to put an on/off on the ASA was to basically put an extension off the back.

I was actually excited to own one but it just left me disappointed.

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AGD did do it better. But... Things can be done about that ASA, which I agree, is terrible. I hate the angle of it with a 68ci.

[Toestr]

Yes, they made it more complicated, that's what tippmann does. This is why the JT tac5 is the same basic design as the 98c with half the parts

The automag is also dwell insensitive as it dumps everything in the dump chamber. Actually, in order to be a mechanical spool this MUST be a feature, otherwise you have no meaningful velocity control

Your theory seems to be that PE somehow copied or at least was inspired by tippmann but unless my timelines are really mixed up, pe was building spools before tippmann. The agd patents had expired and all tippmann had to do to end up at the design they currently have is change when the air in the dump chamber pushes on the bolt. Not even how, just when. Seriously, go put a tippmann bolt next to a agd bolt, next to a PE bolt. "One of these things is not like the others" (hint: it's the PE bolt)




Yeah, nobody cares where the board is. They also split it in 2, just like the impulse. Vision board on the body, control board below. Let's also not forget in order to get that frame off you have to first remove the grip panel so you can turn the safety past it's stop and remove the safety from the frame first, once again, tippmann overcomplicating something

If tippmann is such a leader in design, where's all the c3 copies? The cyclone? Sure the inline blowback has been copied but that's not tippmanns design, apex is the only real backspin barrel past the flatline and it functions pretty differently



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The Flex Valve is actually more simple than a Gamma Core because there is no can and no need to time bolt retraction. This is what the bolt spring accomplishes and is the only functional way it is more similar to an Automag than the Gamma Core.

Isn't the JT Tac 5 known for being terrible?

My point is that the Flex Valve accomplishes the dwell insensitivity in a way more akin to the Gamma Core than the Automag. They both isolate the dump chamber via a sprung spool that moves due to venting air. It's like a set of dominoes; just vent the air and the shot goes off AND the spool is reset automatically regardless of trigger position. I don't see how you can compare it to the Automag when none of the Flex Valve guns have a sear. The reason the bolts are made of stainless is that they would get chewed to shit by the bolt spring if they were aluminum.

Mech ions are dwell sensitive. If you pull the trigger too slowly then it will get lower velocity. And if the trigger is held down it vents the can continuously.

The original Geo came out in 08 or 09 about; the same time as the TPX (the first iteration of the flex Valve). The Gamma Core came out in 2016 with the original Gtek - well after the Phenom and Crossover. I don't know if the previous PE bolt systems were dwell insensitive or not, but it definitely wasn't accomplished the same way with the sprung spool.

Obviously tournament players cared about board location. Otherwise there would still be guns with trays and they would be 1/2" taller. You're right, the drop free frame doesn't really speed up disassembly but it does prevent tearing eye wires (something I have almost done on other guns many times). It's basically required due to the cheap ribbon eyes.

Tippmann is certainly an innovator. All that is required for innovation is to try something new. Whether or not it's successful is a different story. Tippmann did invent the inline blowback (and blowbacks in general) with the SMG60. They standardized ASA threads. They popularized clamshell castings (view that as you will). Those were Tippmann's successful innovations. Obviously Tippmann's current MO is being cheap and regurgitating variations of the 98 continuously. The Flex Valve was successful in its theory of operation but not in practice and was Tippmann's last attempt at innovation.

I'm not trying to evangelize the Flex Valve. It has durability issues with some parts. You've seen my other thread on my Crossover. It was doomed by Tippmann's MO of being cheap and adverse to innovation. Had they put more thought into it, it could have been a poor man's Emag/Emek equivalent nearly a decade before the Emek. The trigger on the mech Crossover is already decent and there are some simple upgrades that could have made it great for mech tournaments.

My Automag is my favorite gun by far. I also prefer my Emek to my Crossover because the Emek actually works. But I do vastly prefer the shot quality of the Crossover to the Emek - it actually has soul.

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[Trbo323]

The only similarities between the Flex Valve and an Automag is that they both have stainless bolts and powertubes with return springs. The Flex Valve has no sear and the valve the trigger actuates just shifts/vents air instead of isolating the dump chamber. The dump chamber gets closed by a spring loaded spool like in the Gamma Core. That's why it's dwell insensitive.

Yes, they made it more complicated, that's what tippmann does. This is why the JT tac5 is the same basic design as the 98c with half the parts

The automag is also dwell insensitive as it dumps everything in the dump chamber. Actually, in order to be a mechanical spool this MUST be a feature, otherwise you have no meaningful velocity control

Your theory seems to be that PE somehow copied or at least was inspired by tippmann but unless my timelines are really mixed up, pe was building spools before tippmann. The agd patents had expired and all tippmann had to do to end up at the design they currently have is change when the air in the dump chamber pushes on the bolt. Not even how, just when. Seriously, go put a tippmann bolt next to a agd bolt, next to a PE bolt. "One of these things is not like the others" (hint: it's the PE bolt)

Yeah I suppose the Impulse frame did drop away, but it also had a tray. This was the first with modern board placement to do so and now everyone has followed suit.

Yeah, nobody cares where the board is. They also split it in 2, just like the impulse. Vision board on the body, control board below. Let's also not forget in order to get that frame off you have to first remove the grip panel so you can turn the safety past it's stop and remove the safety from the frame first, once again, tippmann overcomplicating something

If tippmann is such a leader in design, where's all the c3 copies? The cyclone? Sure the inline blowback has been copied but that's not tippmanns design, apex is the only real backspin barrel past the flatline and it functions pretty differently



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