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Ramping in rec?

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    #31
    Personally I don’t care what anyone shoots as long as they are respectful to new players and get out when shot. I actually enjoy the challenge of shooting out paint hosers it really is my favorite thing. I don’t mind the extra paint in the air and I find people who play like that in rec are generally easier targets. Limited paint/Pump players are way harder to eliminate from my experience. But I do really enjoy placing a clean shot to the lens on someone that’s just ripping random streams of paint.

    I get why fields don’t allow it tho.

    Modern mech can also shoot almost as fast as most ramp sets today. So I don’t really see the difference. But you won’t see me using an electo on anything other than an Xball field.

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      #32
      Last time I used an electro, I left it on uncapped semi. I was able to adjust my pace pretty easily to the target, whether a renter (try for that one-ball snapshot) or a try-hard running 15bps auto. It does ruin the mood when you hear a string rip off, though, and watch all the inexperienced players clam up for the rest of the game.

      It's been a while since I've made it to the field, largely because of this issue. It seems like the teams always turn into renters (and pumps) vs. the 6-pod types all "playing together with their friends". I have more fun tinkering in the garage than playing games like that, and spend less money doing it. I don't expect to be the best player every time I go out, but I expect a ratio somewhat better than 1 good tag every five games. Anymore, it's hard to get off the break without catching half a pod.

      I vote for mandatory gravity hoppers outside of private parties. If I got sick of paintball, I can't imagine what it's doing to the new players.
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        #33
        I think it's all culture. Around me, it's mech, or 10.2 cap. I recently played a bunch of renters with my Reflex Rail on ramping. I don't overshoot though. Everybody still had a great time.

        I also renegade ball with this group in Cleveland. They're field rules are 15bps, two shots for arms and legs, one shot for head and torso. Gun hits don't count. Despite trying to make multiple shots hit your body for an elimination at 15bps, overshooting almost never happens. When it does, it's purely accidental and you'll get an apology after the game. I'll go out there with my Gmek or a pump, and I never fear getting lit up. We even have a few young ladies that play there with their dad, and it's never a problem.
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        • Jonnydread

          Jonnydread

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          Editing a comment
          This is nice to hear. I know that the human behind the marker makes the biggest difference, but from my experience a large number (not all) of the guys who regularly use ramping in rec seem to enjoy hurting people and preserving their ego more than playing paintball. All this said, I know many electro dudes that are regulars are my local fields and don't fit the toxic mould at all, but I see it often in paintball videos. Now that I think of it, many of the videos in question take place at the same field, so that's also leaning into the idea of culture vs. ramp.

        #34
        I just don't know how you enforce anything unless the field is willing to separate the groups.

        That's fine at a larger field, but I know some local ones simply do not get the number of players to run two groups. Hell, the walk-on group last Saturday fell from 20+ to <10 after lunch. Any less and they'll fold you into the rentals.

        I have noticed fields are REALLY pushing private bookings these days, which is ideal for both the field and group.
        Originally posted by Terry A. Davis
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        • Jonnydread

          Jonnydread

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          That's the problem is you can't really enforce anything directly, you really just need the refs to lean on over the top players so they don't feel empowered to be ding dongs.

        • Cdn_Cuda

          Cdn_Cuda

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          I try to do private booking when I play. Usually put out an open invite to people and get a decent turn out and it’s a lot of fun. No morons on the field, can play whatever game we like. Definitely my favourite way to play.

        #35
        Like everyone else, I don't see a place for ramping in walk-on rec games, the possible exception being an airball field full of self-equipped players. Ramping has absolutely no place in woodsball: you're not holding a lane to stop someone from bumping up the doritos or anything like that in the woods, so ramping serves no practical purpose and just leads to overshooting.

        My home field enforces 10bps semi only, and does a speed check as part of the chrono process. My electros are set to that limit and I rarely use them anyway, almost always playing with a mech. The player base is usually 2/3rd to 3/4th rentals or higher, and they run only one game at a time with everyone together, so keeping a level playing field is important.

        As some others have mentioned, field culture really matters. It starts with the owners and staff setting expectations and holding players to them, and requires buy-in from the regulars. Rules only matter where the culture expects and respects their enforcement, and almost paradoxically, the more the culture supports the rules the less they need enforcement. I am grateful to play somewhere with a strong and positive local culture that emphasizes everyone having a good time.

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          #36
          Paintball is a lot like snow skiing.

          1. it’s expensive.
          2. it’s a niche sport
          3. It should be in the Olympics
          4. there’s all kinds of levels
          5. there’s all kinds of different ski’s, boards, sleds
          6. it can be ruined by bad apples, ask skiers about when snowboarders arrived on the scene, most resorts banned boards initially.
          7. There needs to be room for beginners and children, as well as hair dyed custom board maniacs
          8. There needs to be professionally managed racing courses that are advanced level only.

          After all that, there is still discourse and issues on the ski hills. I think looking at our industry as it compares to other similar industries will allow us to not only focus on how to improve but also similarities that be recognized as progress. Keeping up with other extreme sports can only benefit us all.

          They have “climbing up stairs while being sprayed with lube” on ESPN these days. I mean. Come on paintball. “ climbing up stairs being sprayed with lube”…


          For y’all that thought I was joking… 9 million people…let that sink in, 9,000,000,000.

          Watch as the first ever men's and women's Slippery Stairs world champions are crowned. #ESPNTheOcho #TheOcho✔ Subscribe to ESPN+ https://plus.espn.com/✔ Get ...

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          • William the Third

            William the Third

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            I just found a new favorite sport to watch... well at least the women's competition! Five very attractive women wearing skin-tight suits getting all wet and slippery? Yes, please!

          • Brokeass_baller

            Brokeass_baller

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            Yeah, this is just a family friendly wet t-shirt contest

          • Siress

            Siress

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            *plucks banjo*

          #37
          I really don't get the appeal of ramping in a recreational setting. It's one thing if the crowd is mostly equipment owners, I don't have an issue there. But any time there are new/rental players stepping on the field a good player should know how to dial it back. I have to give a shoutout to Splatters in Manitoba and Divide N Conquer up in Saskatoon. Both of these places have owners that care deeply about the player experience, well-maintained fields, reasonable prices, experienced refs, and a player base that wants the rentals to have fun and come back. Very strong safety culture. I am so used to having a top-notch paintball experience that I take it for granted until I go somewhere that is not as good.

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            #38
            Originally posted by Jonnydread View Post
            How do you folks feel about ramping in rec walk-on games?


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              #39
              It's pretty pathetic if a player feels they need ramping against a new player with a rental.

              It's a mixed bag where I am, one field wouldn't care at all

              One field I've been told semi auto only

              Personally I like a field I used to play at before we moved, if there were a lot of new and rental players they would tell anyone with an electro "walk on rules" which meant, semi auto and only 1 finger on the trigger

              These days I just play pump/mech of that's the case
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                #40
                Stupid thought-
                Other than the finger speed required (skill?), what's the difference between someone ramping, someone shooting uncapped semi that can hit 15+, or a mech with a hair trigger? 15bps is 15bps regardless of how it is achieved. I've seen a video from one of the ICPL events where someone was accused of cheating because of the insane ROF they could get with a CVO. I of course can't find it currently, but he was easily close to 20bps.

                And to parrot others- field & player culture plays a huge role, regardless of marker type.
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                • Cyberpyr8
                  Cyberpyr8 commented
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                  I think the difference is that people shooting semi are already trying not to shoot as much and would be more likely to not try and hit 20bps. I can hit fast speeds on my Emeks but I come with the mech to shoot less and hit more. If I am going to try and shoot that fast, I might as well get an electro and turn on ramping. But even when I had a double trigger electro on semi it was capped at 10.

                • Chuck E Ducky

                  Chuck E Ducky

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                  Sometimes but those rental emeks can be just as ruthless sometimes. They just don’t know they are hitting shots when, you’re waving at them calling the first handful that hit. Nerves, and adrenaline pumping they just slinging paint at whatever moves including the guy in front of them on their own team.

                • MrBarraclough
                  MrBarraclough commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Mechs these days can have shockingly high peak ROF, but that's not a sustainable ROF, at least not for anyone but a small handful of highly skilled tournament players. So while it is possible to catch a 15bps burst from a mech, and it will hurt just as much as from an electro, it is less likely to occur. And because of the effort it takes to let off a really high ROF string with a mech, even those players with the skills are only going to do it deliberately. With a ramping electro, it's far easier to overshoot someone without even really thinking about it.

                #41


                Originally posted by cellophane View Post
                Stupid thought-
                Other than the finger speed required (skill?), what's the difference between someone ramping, someone shooting uncapped semi that can hit 15+, or a mech with a hair trigger? 15bps is 15bps regardless of how it is achieved.
                In that scenario there is no difference. The problem though is most of these players can't hit 11bps on semi because they have only ever used ramping. They have no practice pulling the trigger faster than 5bps and typically with only one finger because that's all they have ever needed to do.

                Hell I've been playing for 19 years now and can't hit 15. I max out at 13 and only with my right hand but it's also not like I'm practicing or anything, I don't care to crank out some crazy bps on semi.


                Also when doing something like a run through it's harder to bonus ball the crap out of the birthday kid if you need to pull that trigger for each ball. If the marker is adding a bunch in it's easier to keep that stream going while running



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                • Chuck E Ducky

                  Chuck E Ducky

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                  Especially if you already hit your shots to sustain and it’s pumping out 3-4 a pull.

                #42
                Originally posted by cellophane View Post
                Stupid thought-
                Other than the finger speed required (skill?), what's the difference between someone ramping, someone shooting uncapped semi that can hit 15+, or a mech with a hair trigger? 15bps is 15bps regardless of how it is achieved. I've seen a video from one of the ICPL events where someone was accused of cheating because of the insane ROF they could get with a CVO. I of course can't find it currently, but he was easily close to 20bps.

                And to parrot others- field & player culture plays a huge role, regardless of marker type.
                To me, the biggest difference is the extra balls in the air. If a kid pops out in the wrong spot, or you catch a guy coming around a corner, they tend to get a multiple of three. The extra two in the air after you see the first is going to hit can really ruin someone's day, and if you're just numbly sustaining the ramp without thinking, it can be six.

                I was messing around after a game, the first time I brought it my Torque, wanting to show people how capable it was. Pure semi, I easily was at 15, maybe 18, just shooting a tree. But in game, I can't keep up even 10 without focusing. And more importantly, when I stop, the gun stops. If someone comes around a corner at close range, it's a huge difference.
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                  #43
                  The simple answer is: What is the field allowing?
                  Every field in my area except one, had "Semi-Auto Only" rules and ramping is not Semi Auto. That leaves out folks who can walk their triggers which, I would simply enforce a 8-10 BPS cap on any electo guns. Unfortunately, there are no ways to go any further for new, double finger mechanical guns, or response triggers.

                  flyweightnate. You said it well in regards to the number of balls in the air. When someone commits to walking the trigger on someone, there will at least be three balls in the air before the first one hits.
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                  Unfortunately all of you have played the one "speedball" game of paintball for so long you can't conceive of other ways to do this and hence any new ideas seem stupid.
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