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Old 05-27-2019, 07:12 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Prices on cocker frames have come down to earth a little but I am guessing that frame especially in gloss black would still bring a premium.
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Old 05-27-2019, 09:16 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Glossy and dust black bring the most. Complete ones bring more $ too. I prefer colored ones myself. These days brand doesn't seem to matter as much.
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Old 05-28-2019, 02:02 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I notice some of the Professional frames have Dye stamped onto them (mine doesn't). Was the Dye part a later year thing, or did Freeflow produce them for Dye to also badge?


Just to answer this as i saw it never got answered.

Like a lot of pb companies dye got their start by making aftermarket parts (barrels, frames etc) eventually they started making a private lable cocker (dye reflex and dye ultralight were 2 of the most popular, I'm not sure if they were the only ones though)

So the dye frames could be stand alone frames or have come off of one of the dye PL cockers


As far as I know, dye produces everything metal at least in house. There was a time that DLX came to them trying to strike a deal for dye to produce the luxe for them (no idea if that went through or not)

If you go to the dye precision web page (NOT dye paintball) last I saw, which was years ago granted, they had photos of basically a warehouse packed with cnc and metal working machines.

Just checked out the web page again out if curiosity, it has changed but here is a short video from their Instagram page walking around some of their production floor

https://www.instagram.com/p/Be3VgNPB..._web_copy_link
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Last edited by Trbo323; 05-28-2019 at 02:11 PM.
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Old 05-28-2019, 03:40 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I've never seen a Professional frame that didn't have the DYE stamp. From what I understand, all Professional frames were just DYE frames with some additional milling.

But yeah, DYE does a ton of machining for a variety of different industries. This is one of the reasons DYE as a paintball manufacturer has remained in operation for so long, despite having very little market share for the last decade. I want to say they did a lot of aerospace and military contracts, but I could be wrong.
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Old 05-28-2019, 04:39 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I've never seen a Professional frame that didn't have the DYE stamp. From what I understand, all Professional frames were just DYE frames with some additional milling.

But yeah, DYE does a ton of machining for a variety of different industries. This is one of the reasons DYE as a paintball manufacturer has remained in operation for so long, despite having very little market share for the last decade. I want to say they did a lot of aerospace and military contracts, but I could be wrong.
Almost seems like whoever is in charge at dye just likes paintball and happens to own a machine shop....

Now I want them to make another cocker
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Old 05-28-2019, 04:52 PM   #16 (permalink)
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That's exactly what's going on. Dave Dehaan (aka Dave Youngblood) used to play for the Ironmen back in the 80s, started DYE Precision in 94. DYE is actually an acronym for "Dave Youngblood Enterprises", though it seems weird since the full title would thus be "Dave Youngblood Enterprises Precision." But anyway, I don't know all of the details bue he started making barrels for the Ironmen (the Boomstick) out of his garage, and essentially built up from there. I want to say he originally worked for Earon Carter, and grew out from there, but that's all before my time.

I'd like to see a DYE cocker again, but given how lousy Reflexes are, I don't think it would be a smart decision. They look pretty, but that's about it.
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Old 05-28-2019, 05:34 PM   #17 (permalink)
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That's exactly what's going on. Dave Dehaan (aka Dave Youngblood) used to play for the Ironmen back in the 80s, started DYE Precision in 94. DYE is actually an acronym for "Dave Youngblood Enterprises", though it seems weird since the full title would thus be "Dave Youngblood Enterprises Precision." But anyway, I don't know all of the details bue he started making barrels for the Ironmen (the Boomstick) out of his garage, and essentially built up from there. I want to say he originally worked for Earon Carter, and grew out from there, but that's all before my time.

I'd like to see a DYE cocker again, but given how lousy Reflexes are, I don't think it would be a smart decision. They look pretty, but that's about it.
1) cool info on dye, I didn't know that

2) I've never owned a reflex, I've heard the 3 way is not very good but what else isn't good about them?

3) opinion on the ultralight cocker? I've always wanted one more based on the look but I've never known how they shoot
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Old 05-28-2019, 05:52 PM   #18 (permalink)
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All of the pneumatics are pretty much garbage. The frames are decent, but they tend to have a very hard trigger break. I'm going to experiment with a rounded lug to see if that helps, but between that and the smallish trigger guard, they're one of my least favorite hinge frames. Valves are fine (pretty much a WGP stainless valve). But the biggest problem is the bolt and back block. They're heavy, so the gun is kicky. And you're stuck with the quarter turn metal bolt. A few people have made small runs of delrin bolts but they're exceptionally hard to find. If you wanted to commit an unforgivable sin to Velcor, you could drill out the back block so that you can use an Evo length bolt. But it'll be ugly, and again you're committing a veritable atrocity.

I built a Reflex for a teammate, and it was just a mess. Granted, it had an E2 on it, which confounds things. I've set up multiple ebladed guns, that had nary an issue. This one was nonstop chopping and recock issues. Maybe it would have been better without the eblade. I don't know. But the bolt would get hot when cycling to the point of giving off a burning smell.

I don't have any experience with the Ultralites, but I have had some experience with Superbolts, which are [admittedly very low quality] knockoffs of them. The bodies are very light, which means that they're even more kicky than reflexes are.

As a whole, I just don't recommend them. Like I said, they look amazing. In fact, I remember a few months after I had started playing in 07, I acquired some old issues of APG from my school library. I still remember the moment when I came across the full-page DYE Reflex ad. Amazing looking guns, probably the singular moment that got me into autocockers. They just don't work very well.
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Old 05-28-2019, 06:03 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Don't own your heros I guess
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Old 05-28-2019, 07:59 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Dye cockers sure are good looking though. Their frames are nothing special though, even the sliders. I love my ANS frames! I really like my inception designs one too but need to modify it for one of my pre 99 projects.
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