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Old 06-15-2019, 09:02 AM   #301 (permalink)
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Have you looked at the springpheed apocalypse is making? That could be an option for a feedgate and if you worked with him to have them printed rather than machined you would save yourself a lot of headache
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Old 06-15-2019, 03:34 PM   #302 (permalink)
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And two is a loading gate. I'd hoped to have a side "door" like an actual cartridge lever rifle, but I simply haven't been able to come up with a workable version of this. And by "workable", I mean one that doesn't make the receiver 2" longer, doesn't require machining half a dozen additional parts, and doesn't require two minutes and three hands to operate.

I've drawn up many dozens of other options, some of which hold a little promise, but as I'm sketching them on proverbial cocktail napkins rather than CAD designing them, I won't know if they're truly workable until I actually try and build one.

That's the main thing that's been holding me up- I hate to start cutting the receiver parts without even knowing what kind of gate I'm going to use.

Doc.
Maybe like a Sheridan style speedfeed but at a low angle out the side. So small spring loaded lever that's tripped when you shove a 10rd tube in. I think that would look pretty dope and be relatively user friendly, but its probably impractical to manufacture.
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Old 06-15-2019, 05:10 PM   #303 (permalink)
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Have you looked at the springpheed apocalypse is making? That could be an option for a feedgate and if you worked with him to have them printed rather than machined you would save yourself a lot of headache
-Well, I have my own 3D printer. The problem is one of space, not style of manufacturing.

To mount the gate on the receiver, where it "should" be, unfortunately puts it right where the feed passage has to make a right-angle turn upwards. There's both very limited space (thin walls, internal passages, the lever mechanism directly behind, etc.) and the geometry of trying to put the feed door right at the 90-degree bend in the passage, which together make it a very tricky situation.

Meaning we may have to simply go with the "hole in the feed tube" method just for the sake of simplicity.

There are, unfortunately, times where doing it the "cool" way is simply not workable, for a variety of reasons. (We have, after all, seen attempts over the years at HUD goggles, electric-driven markers, grenades and Gatling guns, none of which have been what you'd call commercially successful. )

I'm still noodling the idea, but this may very well be a case of "pretty good, but now" beats "perfect and cool, at some indeterminate point in the future".

Doc.
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Old 06-15-2019, 07:49 PM   #304 (permalink)
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If you go with the old hole in the tube style you can tell everyone you were tipping your hat at the original Henry repeating rifle and you'll never have to admit defeat publicly. If you do go that route please try to go after what Agent Smith did with his Zeus pistol instead of the removable endcap. Not that my requests mean much, I'm already sold on getting one.
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Old 06-16-2019, 05:00 AM   #305 (permalink)
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I wouldn't call it "admitting defeat"- I have three or four very possible versions for it, but they all require either too many additional parts or in some cases too many hands to easily use.

The biggest trick has to be ease-of-use. One hand to flip the door open, dump in a tube, snap the cover shut. (Or let it snap shut under spring tension.) And NOT- here's the tricky part- dump what's already in the tube when you pop that thing open.

If you haven't reread the build pages recently, recall I had to fab a kind of oddball follower for the spring feed in order to get the paint to go UP from the lower tube.

Popping the feed gate open under spring pressure and having all your paint come flying out is bad enough- but you don't also want the follower to fly out, even partway, and either jam something up or take two hands (or more) to tuck back into place.

And see, that's theoretically even a problem with the "hole in the tube" version- the 2 piece follower may hang up in the opening, when refilling. No matter how cool this gun look or works, no one's gonna like it if it can't be reloaded quickly and easily on the field.

It needs to be like a Phantom or any other SC marker- at least one with a spring-fed tube. Slide the follower up and lock it, dump in a tube, release the follower, get back to play. One hand, for the most part, 15 to 20 seconds max.

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Old 06-17-2019, 04:36 PM   #306 (permalink)
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Would it be feasible to do a magnetic trap door ala Apocalypse, at the base of the feed tube? Slide and lock the follower with the marker pointed down, use the 10 round tube to push the trap door open, letting the balls drop in, door snaps shut when you pull the tube out, release the follower?
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Old 06-18-2019, 07:23 AM   #307 (permalink)
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If you're getting away from the trapdoor feedgate idea then the DSG follower and feed gate method worked. 1 tube inside the other with a slot for the follower pin. Draw the pin back up to the muzzle and twist to lock, which rotates the inner tube and opens the feed port down at the receiver end.

Major drawback being the last 3 or so paintballs don't get fed by the spring feed (but can be done in a pinch by turning the gun over while pumping).
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Old 06-18-2019, 08:50 AM   #308 (permalink)
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Instead of the "ball on a string" 2-piece follower, what about a slot in the front of the main follower and another in the back of the ball, with a link between them? That way the ball can only move on one axis (so that it can't fall out of the feed port), and I bet with careful positioning of the slot, you could limit its upward movement to prevent it from entering the chamber...

Hopefully I made that clear enough. I can make a quick sketch if it's not.
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Old Yesterday, 02:54 AM   #309 (permalink)
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Would it be feasible to do a magnetic trap door ala Apocalypse, at the base of the feed tube?
-The method used to close or latch the door isn't the problem. It's finding the physical room FOR the door, in a relatively complex portion of the receiver, and also right where the feed passage has to make a hard 90 degree turn.

Again, I have a few potentially workable ideas, but none are what I'd call elegant, nor particularly easy to use.

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Draw the pin back up to the muzzle and twist to lock, which rotates the inner tube and opens the feed port down at the receiver end.
-The tricky part there is finding or making "telescoping" tube- that is, two pieces of thin-wall tubing that "nest" closely inside one another. That also has the effect of making the lower tube larger in diameter, adding more parts, etc.

It's not unworkable, of course, but in my opinion it isn't ideal.

Quote:
Major drawback being the last 3 or so paintballs don't get fed by the spring feed (but can be done in a pinch by turning the gun over while pumping).
-And that, to me, is unacceptable. It's fine for a one-off custom build that you do just 'cause it's cool. Like the prototype's inability to be reloaded without an allen wrench and three minutes of fiddling. It's fine for a prototype, and I'm sure half of you would call that a good trade-off for being able to swing a gun this cool on the field but things like that are not acceptable, to me, for a production marker.

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Instead of the "ball on a string" 2-piece follower, what about a slot in the front of the main follower and another in the back of the ball, with a link between them?
-Actually, that was my first idea for the follower. The problem was, it needs a "guide" to keep the 'finger' pointed in the right direction, since it would have to be a "hinge" (that is, it only bends in one direction) rather than a "universal joint" which could bend in any direction.

Now, the 'guide' is easy, since the plan has pretty much always been to have a follower that you can slide externally, like virtually all other spring-tube markers. Just have the external "knob" or handle for the follower act as a guide, keeping the 'finger' from rotating.

I didn't do that on the prototype since it was much easier just to do the "tethered ball" thing, and I wasn't at all sure how I wanted to do the slot or the external follower.

The Gen III prototype will have a more refined feed system, as well as the 12-gram changer. So we'll see what sort of thing I can pull off.

Doc.
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Old Yesterday, 09:42 AM   #310 (permalink)
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I was getting ready to place a $4K order for parts from CCI when Mike told me he was low on stock and getting ready to retire.

I'll be placing the same order with the new guys as soon as they get their supply built up. I might have to send 'em the order, and let 'em fill it as they have the parts made, and ship once it's all together.

Doc.
If they are refilling stock anyway, giving them some sort of heads up or deposit might be worth a discount to you.

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-Well, I have my own 3D printer.

Doc.
I'm not thinking that the Duke would have 3d printed parts, but this reminds me of the ICD changer pull tab I printed. You could print, then CNC a wood cover for the ICD handle to merge the changer face into the stock. Like this, but longer, wider, and with more wood. The hole in the ICD handle takes a screw or roll pin very well. That's a lot of wood finishing though.

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