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Ghost Flanker 02-12-2018 01:44 AM

FSR Capable, Bottom-Loaded Magfed Automag Project
 
After having recently and successfully DAM’d a Hammer 7 (thanks to Aggroman), I now have a slightly more ambitious idea: to build a magfed Automag. I’ve daydreamed quite a bit over the years on how a traditionally magazine fed Mag could be accomplished. Plus, I already own, I don’t know, like 8 or 9 Automags along with lots of extra AGD parts, so why not give it a try? That said, I have 3 very specific requirements that I’ve set for this project:

1. Must accept magazines that load up vertically into the bottom of the gun. No Bren or Sten style configurations.
2. Must be First Strike Round capable.
3. Must feed every last round from the magazine.

Here’s a quick mock-up of what I plan to build:
https://i.imgur.com/ilt0Qx6.jpg
Yes, those are hex wrenches standing in for what will be the trigger and trigger guard.:)

To meet these requirements, some serious work will need to be done:
- Grind out a D-shaped hole thru bottom of main body and Doc’s adapter.
- Move frame all the way back to the end of the rail.
- Remove trigger from frame.
- Remove trigger rod assembly from sear elbow.
- Fasten a trigger directly to the bottom of the sear elbow, which should poke right down into the frame’s trigger guard.
- Chop off the front 3” of the AM/MM rail (more if an RTP rail is used).
- Drill/tap the body, frame, and magwell as needed to bolt them all together.
- Grind down any bolt tips that extend into the main body’s inner diameter.

The tricky part will be getting the last round to feed in a bottom-loaded configuration. This means that the magazine must be very close to the breech, so simply bolting a magwell onto a rail with a D-shaped hole will not work. The rail must be cut away completely (maintaining structural integrity with so much of the rail missing will be a challenge) so that the magazine can get close enough for its follower to reach the bottom of the breech’s bore. A DAM magazine’s follower will reach the bottom of an automag’s breech if the top of the magazine is butted directly against the bottom of the main body (TiPX Trufeed magazine followers don’t extend nearly as far and would require a significant amount of the main body and twist-lock to be ground away) so DAM magazines seem to be a logical choice.

I know others have built their own magfed Automags in the past, but I’m unaware of any builds that satisfy all 3 of my previously stated requirements. Photobucket ruining the internet makes thorough research very difficult, though, so I’m sure there are more builds other than just the ones I’ve been able to find. If you know of any other magfed Automags out there, especially like the one I’m planning, share it below. I’d be very interested to check out what else has been done.

Here are some notable examples of magfed Automag builds that I’ve seen already:

Horizontal top feed zeta Automag:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-lo8aqJbAtM

Dead Cell horizontal left side feed posted by ventturei26 from MCB:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=UU7...&v=PCf-ExtKt-c

Vertical left side feed zeta Automag:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kP8Jk1nkF-c

FSR left feed revolver Automag:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq_KY9yuYw4
Not exactly magfed, but close enough. And super cool.

Sten style left side feed Automag posted by sQuidvision on AO:
https://i.imgur.com/qm9J9lu.jpg

DAM’d Automag by Virus and punisher068 on MCB:
https://i.imgur.com/96gl5Gy.jpg

TiPX’d Automag CAD mock-up posted by russc on MCB:
https://i.imgur.com/Qm4hZnE.jpg
This beautiful design would’ve satisfied all 3 requirements, but unfortunately I don’t believe a prototype was ever built.

If you’ve made it this far, any words of caution or advice for this project would be greatly appreciated.

punisher068 02-12-2018 02:10 AM

I did 2 Automag builds with DAM magazines,my teammate did a slightly more successful one.That pic is my teammate Viruses build .We kind of Co built all three together.Oddly the other mentioned from venturii is my coworker and chainman at work.After seeing ours he took a stab at it himself with similar,unsatisfied results

I was never able to get mine to crono FSRS above 260,my teammates was successful at field crono speed
Let me tell you this was the biggest PITA mod I've ever done , not to discourage you,and have done more than a few customs
There's several issues you'll encounter
Sear activation-The most critical thing in the Mag.I ended up using a Winchester slide frame with a homemade slide extension.It worked fairly well and has 2 points of adjustment

Breech adapter- I used a Docs Cocker adapter.This solved 2 problems,how to cover the original feedneck hole &more options especially rifled barrels.Of course I had to cut the D shape for FSRS

How to secure the body-since the front retaining bolt on the stock rail and frame goes DIRECTLY where the feed needs to be in relation to the bolt I used a Automag sight rail and made an adapter so I could bolt it directly to the rail.I tapped holes in the rail for the fastners.I also cut a D shape thru the rail

Triggerframe mine was completely custom,it's hard to describe without pics.Mybteammate used a highly modded Cocker swing frame

Can't tell you how frustrating this build was.I came so close twice without a reliable finished project
When and if I revise it I'll definitely consider doing a PnueMag setup
Keep in mind my tooling only consists of basic power tools like a drill press and Dremmels and files and Mags are pretty close tolerance machines

Feel free to PM me with questions , I'd love to see someone successful build one.My teammates is almost there but it's a little too fragile for anything but a prototype
Good luck,hope you do better than I did

punisher068 02-12-2018 02:20 AM

And to solve your issue on the last round feeding I just filed down the small tabs on the side of the follower so it would extend up the extra 1/8th (?) inch

ShinyGuy 02-13-2018 03:28 AM

Such a thing already exists if you can find one for sale

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...px-FN_303.JPEG

They're a little expensive and need modification to shoot under 300fps.

Walking Stick 02-13-2018 04:08 AM

^ That is a Tom Kaye projectile slinger so it's a 'Mag.

A mag'd 'Mag... Let me start by saying I know nothing of these FS rounds amd magfed in paintball. But I do have two thoughts which punisher068 already addressed.

1. Go with a pneu trigger set up as it'll allow you much more freedom in trigger (not frame) relocation and sear activation. However, it'll make tedious tuning even more tricky. Moving the frame rearward seems dubious as it would put the valve-retaining thumbscrew and shim in an inconvenient position. TK has recommended in the past to not use a washerless thumbscrew or standard screw - if you were thinking of going that route.

2. Can't you just build up the height of the mag follower with an epoxy or such to make sure the last round feeds?

Ghost Flanker 02-13-2018 11:58 AM

punisher068,

I thought I saw the DAM’d Automag in one of your posts. Thanks for confirming. Original post above has been edited.

And that’s an interesting approach — modding the magazines so the followers extend further out. But yeah, I figure this build won’t be an easy one. You mentioned that your gun couldn’t chrono above 260. Any idea why? I can’t fathom a reason it would struggle to get up to proper velocity if the engine was kosher, especially with FSR. And in what other ways were the results of your builds unsatisfying? Was it all structural integrity? What about feed reliability and overall functionality?

I intend to leave the stock sear geometry alone for the most part. I’m only going to attach a trigger directly to the sear. I performed a quick test where I aired up an ULT’d mag without its frame (used a specially cut 10-32 bolt so that nothing was loose, of course) and it shot fine with me pulling the elbow of the sear as if it were a trigger.

To fasten the rail to the body, I will use multiple bolts on both sides of the sear slot where the two pieces meet in order to help preserve structural integrity as much as possible. Just gonna bolt the hell out of it.

Ghost Flanker 02-13-2018 12:06 PM

ShineyGuy,

Ah, the FN 303. I suppose it does satisfy my requirements.

uv_halo 02-13-2018 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Flanker (Post 3458975)
ShineyGuy,

Ah, the FN 303. I suppose it does satisfy my requirements.

I would've suggested that if I hadn't thought that you just were looking forward to the challenge of doing this.

In my opinion, the FN303 is the classic Cadillac of FSR shooters. Sure, it doesn't look milsim or such but, with FSRs it works wonderfully (after getting the velocity down).

Arsenal 02-13-2018 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Flanker (Post 3458975)
ShineyGuy,

Ah, the FN 303. I suppose it does satisfy my requirements.

And can be completely rebuilt with one Automag and one RT seal kit. Don't ask how I know.

Ghost Flanker 02-13-2018 12:47 PM

No, no, the FN 303 is definitely an option and I’d love to have one, but this is really about the challenge of the build.

Besides, not everyone can own an FN 303, but if I pull this off as a viable home mod that others can follow, then any Automag owner with simple tools can have a magfed mag.


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