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Old 01-13-2018, 11:03 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Barrel length performance comparison demo by MCS

https://youtu.be/i4iVY0ALp9c

Of course, the scientific method was by no means used in the slightest in this demonstration. Furthermore, this comparison was performed by not only a manufacturer, but one that has a history of making unfounded and exaggerated claims about its products, and so I take this with a grain salt.

That said, this video does raise an interesting question; When shooting FSRs, are excessively long rifled barrels ( 20”+) really just all for show? Or can they actually provide improved performance (specifically accuracy and air efficiency) over their shorter counterparts?

I was under the impression that excessively long barrels reduce air efficiency in high pressure guns like the Hammer 7, and do not improve (or worsen) accuracy. According to this video, though, that’s incorrect.
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Old 01-13-2018, 03:19 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I am curious as to others thoughts on this as I thought the same. Heard some say the 20in would perform better with co2 rather than hpa.
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Old 01-13-2018, 08:49 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I don't believe there has been any rigorous and documented testing of the 20" barrel. It's fairly hard to get ahold of unless you got it with a Carmatech. I believe Carmatech published some outdoor data with the 20" but, I can't find it and, it's also from Carmatech (not accusing them of anything, I just believe the data we rely on should be independent from vested interests).

That being said, I think Carmatech's position that the barrel worked better with their SAR than it would on other systems (something to do with the pressure pulse output by the SAR, etc).

The testing I helped Punkworks out with showed definite improvements related to barrel length but, only a slight edge to the longer barrel at 16".

My own theory is that because first strike rounds slip (or get sheared) over the rifling to some extent, a longer barrel allows for the potential of a greater spin application by the time the projectile leaves the muzzle. However, they may not slip enough to see much of a benefit at longer barrel lengths.

This will translate to a completely different set of answers with the new spline drive barrels (aka Nemesis) that Carmatech put out.

It's been documented that one-piece barrels do have a length where going longer begins to see drops in efficiency when using regular paint. However, given that FS rounds in non-underbore conditions fly at a higher velocity compared to regular paint it would seem to me that their most efficient length could be longer than what we've seen with regular paint. How much longer? I don't know (need testing) but, fortunately for me, I'm not worried about efficiency all that much (consistency matters more to me).
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:57 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I like seeing the fact that you don’t need a 1200$$ set up ! Could the combo of barrel length and higher output pressure be the key ? I believe in the lapco 683 I have on my fsr phantom . It’s psi is at 750 now I’m going to up it to 850. I shot a lot with a Ccm SSR and this phantom is more consistent and accurate. Only difference was psi ,(same barrels)the SSR is running at 410. The hammer7 is running at 900 ish I assume . I see outstanding results from the mcs fsr DMRwith the long barrel too . Mcs guns all run higher psi . We believe the lapco rifling is engaged better and maintained due to the burst of high psi . Could long barrel high psi be the formula!
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Old 01-14-2018, 12:48 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Barrel length performance comparison demo by MCS

I believe this video was released after the war between carmatech and mcs got out. Apparently carmatech had a verbal aggrement with mcs/hammerhead to keep exclusivity of 20 inch barrels for the sar and mcs/hammerhead decided “screw em” and released it to the public. Then carmatech went out and created its own barrel . Of course this what i understood of it. Someone correct me if this is wrong.

Personally i dint shoot fsr and never tried the sar so i couldnt care less. I just find it funny that both companies comes out with claims 100% contradicting the other. Who are we to believe right? .

Carmatech claim of needing a bigger dweel to use full advantage of the longer barrel makes sense. But then againit doesnt mean it wont improve accuracy on other markers.


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Old 01-14-2018, 10:03 PM   #6 (permalink)
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What’s really odd about carmatechs new barrel is their charging more to SAR owners to get it I think it’s 20 inch . You have to send a serial # pic to get it . These are your loyal consumers you’d think it would be beneficial to charge them less . I’ll sit back and wait a bit on my next FSR related purchase.
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Old 01-14-2018, 11:28 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Ridingmac View Post
I believe this video was released after the war between carmatech and mcs got out. Apparently carmatech had a verbal aggrement with mcs/hammerhead to keep exclusivity of 20 inch barrels for the sar and mcs/hammerhead decided “screw em” and released it to the public. Then carmatech went out and created its own barrel . Of course this what i understood of it. Someone correct me if this is wrong.

Personally i dint shoot fsr and never tried the sar so i couldnt care less. I just find it funny that both companies comes out with claims 100% contradicting the other. Who are we to believe right? .

Carmatech claim of needing a bigger dweel to use full advantage of the longer barrel makes sense. But then againit doesnt mean it wont improve accuracy on other markers.


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I'd be surprised if Carmatech had any agreement with MCS given that Carmatech arranged for that barrel before MCS acquired Hammerhead, IIRC.

Several years ago, I talked to the founder of Hammerhead a couple times, trying to convince him to release an Autococker 1pc threaded barrel (before Carmatech got theirs). He couldn't be bothered even when I told him about the positive results in testing, and the number of FS gun models using AC threading. So, it would make sense that Carmatech probably didn't have an ongoing contract but rather, fronted the money for a run (or several runs) of them. This would also explain why you couldn't get them from Hammerhead directly (they wouldn't stock them).

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What’s really odd about carmatechs new barrel is their charging more to SAR owners to get it I think it’s 20 inch . You have to send a serial # pic to get it . These are your loyal consumers you’d think it would be beneficial to charge them less . I’ll sit back and wait a bit on my next FSR related purchase.
Hmmm. This makes me think one of two things are going on:
1. Carmatech's not manufacturing these barrels and having them produced in runs (I wonder who would be producing them) and wants to ensure that their existing gun owners aren't left high and dry, waiting for the next run.
2. Carmatech wants to be absolutely sure that their gun owners get these barrels first (i.e. they really perform better and he wants to use them to help sell his guns).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Kaye -in response to FS price critics
Unfortunately all of you have played the one "speedball" game of paintball for so long you can't conceive of other ways to do this and hence any new ideas seem stupid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Death View Post
First strike rounds punish lazy people. Don't be lazy and you won't have problems with first strikes.
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Old 01-15-2018, 01:36 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I have never seen or heard any shady crap from Carmatech. All their info and claims seem to be spot on.

This is just a smear video in the ongoing spat most likely (and unfortunately).
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Old 01-15-2018, 02:31 PM   #9 (permalink)
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They misspelled Hammerhead in the video title.
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:11 PM   #10 (permalink)
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They also misspelled “comparison” in the video title.

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