GOG eNMEy + SMAV-3

[gnarlynick]

Found a fitting that may work. It has a male 10-32 threaded end with an o-ring to seal it against the vertical ASA, and a 5/32 push connect end that matches the OD of the tubing I currently have.

https://www.digikey.com/short/w2bhb49p

[Magmoormaster]

Nice, yeah I was thinking it would be cool to find a push-to-connect fitting for the front. Also not a bad price. The operating pressure is a bit low but from what I understand that's typical of all fittings in paintball.

Depending on how much space there is, it might be worth throwing a washer on the upper portion of the valve, so the trigger has a slightly longer pull. YMMV, but I always find a super short trigger to be slower than one with a bit of travel.

[gnarlynick]

I did have reservations about the operating pressure as well. I believe these markers are operating close enough within that range that it likely shouldn't be an issue. I have found an alternative fitting with a higher pressure rating should that be an issue. We'll see.

Regarding the valve placement, I believe any more adjustments up from the trigger frame toward the upper body would require some mounting fixture to be designed to allow for that. As it is currently, there are probably 2-3 threads showing through to the grip area for the nut to screw onto, not much wiggle room left. I could probably grind down the end of the actuator pin a bit to add a bit more distance between the trigger and the pin contact area. I'm also planning on modifying the trigger a bit and printing a new one for this, so perhaps that's where that distance can be fine tuned a little more. I won't do anything until I can pressurize the system as it is right now and see how it cycles.

[gnarlynick]

The ASA fitting arrived today. Screwed it in finger-tight which is why I believe it's leaking in the video, but did a quick proof of concept. The hose lengths need to be adjusted to get everything to button up, hence why it's all pulled apart.

https://youtube.com/shorts/W1MMbGlk2...fajDMQOn8LF5ao

Update:
Now with no leaks!
https://youtube.com/shorts/EMVWjEcS8...vN8sQXWXwWngJt

Had to shave off a thread's length to get it to fully seal against the o-ring. Also added a bit of thread seal tape. In the process, found that the over pressure exhaust is in the most unhelpful location for troubleshooting a leak in this exact area. Apparently the reg seat I put in the other day already went bad? Anyways, progress. The tubing that came with the SSC kit is cut to size for an Ion and it doesn't quite work for this. I may look into ordering some more and cutting it all to length.

[Magmoormaster]

Awesome!! Really cool to see this work. I still need to find a suitable trigger valve for my second gun (technically my friend's), it's good to know this is an option.

Re: hose length, it mostly looks like it's too long, right? It's a pain to pull it off the fittings, but you shouldn't need to order new hose. Should be able to cut down what you have.

And going back to the trigger length, yeah the available thread length crossed my mind at one point and then fell out of my brain lol. Adding extra room thru the trigger probably makes the most sense. Theoretically you could remove the button on the valve, but that might negatively affect the feel.

Anyway, thank you for being the guinea pig on this one!!

[gnarlynick]

Ya, it's mostly too long but also too short (if that makes sense) when I'm trying to work with it and everything is in the way.

I cut down the hose to the ASA and the vertical one going from the tee to the SMAV-3. Having difficulty with the one coming from the SMAV-3 to the QEV coming loose when I try and close everything up.

Perhaps it's just been stretched too much to keep a proper seal under pressure. Unfortunately, I don't want to cut that one any shorter since it's troublesome enough. I'll continue to mess with it and see where I can get.

[gnarlynick]

Holy hell this is getting frustrating. When trying to close everything up with the body on the frame, either of the two lines on the SMAV-3 barbs get knocked loose and come off when I pressurize it.

While trying to play with different configurations of placing those two hoses when putting the two halves together, the reg's overpressure valve starts exhausting air again. Not sure why I'm going through reg seats on this reg like I am, clearly something is wrong. I dialed it in to around 150 PSI. I'll swap some of the pressure/velocity adjuster parts out with some other spares I have. Maybe the piston spring?

I'm taking a sanity break before I break anything.

[Calvin]

After 2 days of working on electronic nonsense, I want to do this with my Envy's, and then also my Emneys as the valves inevitably die. It seems to me that the way to accomplish this 3 now to 6 eventual conversions is to get the needed supplies directly from Clippard. As I have never worked in this tiny hose medium before, I have many questions. I want to standardize the hose type and fittings used. 1/8" OD 1/16" ID seems to be the one to go with. What is the proper go to tubing for this use? Right now this product is looking right to me:
https://www.clippard.com/part/URH1-0402-CLT-050

As for the fittings, I am seeing some push quick fittings being used:
https://www.clippard.com/part/PQ-ME04N-PKG
https://www.clippard.com/part/PQ-CC04N-PKG

Barb fittings seem more standard:
https://www.clippard.com/part/UT0-2-PKG
https://www.clippard.com/part/11792-5-PKG

Is there any advantage to the push quick fitting at these pressures? The barb types appear to be a bit more compact, which has obvious advantages.

I am not seeing the 3 way 1/16 barb T fitting anywhere on their website. Does anyone know where that part is on Clippard's site, or know of another site I can buy all of these parts on?

My goal is to make a parts list from a single online retailer that one can simply order the entire contents needed and have plenty of materials to work away until a conversion is done in whatever manner possible.

[Calvin]

Thanks for the info. I went with Clippard for all of the items except the QEV. Just ordered three SP 360 QEV from Action Village on Ebay to complete it. One way or another, it's happening.

[RPP]

You have to buy 250 T's at a time ?!

[gnarlynick]

RPP there's a package of 5 option

[gnarlynick]

I am having an issue with getting the 1/16" ID tubing to stay in place on the SMAV-3 barb fittings. It's holding fine in the 1/16” OD barb ends of the tee and the QEV, just the SMAV-3 barbs are the issue.

The issue may currently be the tube is too short when closing everything up, it jostles enough to shimmy off the barb and when pressurized it's able to come off completely. But I mainly think what I have is too soft of a material and not getting a good enough bite on the barb to stay on.

I tried cutting the end off of the current tubing to see if I just need a "fresh" end to fit over the barb but it seems to be the same no matter what. I very likely need to get some stiffer tubing for the two SMAV-3 connections.

[Calvin]

Are the old school tophats used in autococker 3 ways still around? Might be just the thing to mechanically lock it.

[gnarlynick]

You think the SMAV-3 is 6-40 threaded?

Disregard, I thought you were talking about the barbs that screw into the three ways.

Do those tophats just slide on and hold everything together or do they need to be crimped?

[Calvin]

IIRC, you place them over the hose, push the hose onto the barb, and then back the tophat over the hose on the barb. It wasnt crimped, and was reusable.

[Calvin]

Probably a certain type of brass grommet. I cant see those being manufactured for that one use.

[gnarlynick]

I ordered some top hats to see if that'll remedy the 1/8" hose fitment issue. Not sure on an ETA for those at the moment.

I should be receiving new GOG regulator parts today to properly rebuild the reg. The previous reg rebuild was just using the original "retired rental" parts with a lot of cleanup performed to them along with new seals and lubrication. They were still in sketchy shape despite all those efforts. Here's hoping brand new internal parts make it work without constantly blowing a reg seat.

[ChillswitchEngage]

Those autococker hose tophats/collars are exactly what I ended up using on my mechanical ion build to have the internal hoses stay in place, hoping it works out for you as well.

[Calvin]

I just got my order of Clippard parts for this project. I am working on a SMAV mount for the Envy trigger frame. While I was at it, I made up some tophatesque hose clips to secure the hoses. Took a couple tries to get the fit just right, but the larger hose size is done. Will get the smaller hose clamps done after dinner before working some more on the SMAV mount.

[The Hobbit]

I just saw inception design advertising hose retainers with their pneumatics. No idea if they’re available individually though.

[ChillswitchEngage]

They are the same exact as these ones I believe.

https://autocockerparts.com/autocock...ocks-set-of-6/

[Calvin]

SMAV mount and 1-16ID hose clamps completed. I am quite sure these will retain the hoses on the barbs. Sadly, I purchased three Smart Parts QEVs not realizing how huge the barbs are. I installed two of those QEVs to my two Enmeys, and ordered three Clippard MEV-2 with a 10 pack of 10-32 to 1/16 barbs. What's another week of waiting. 🤷♂️

[gnarlynick]

In addition to the tophats, I had also ordered some autococker 3-way hose and that material seems to be more rigid than the (I'm assuming) silicone hose included with the SSC mech Ion kit I had. This allows it to get a better grip from the hose barbs on the SMAV-3 and it's in there pretty good now and I don't believe requires the tophats. Takes quite a bit of effort to pull them loose.

I was able to close everything up and do some test fires. The trigger certainly needs redesigned as it currently resting right against the SMAV-3 actuator makes completing a cycle inconsistent. I will try and carve out some time in the near future to modify the trigger model and see what works best with this setup. The part of the trigger that contacts the actuator needs to be brought downward quite a bit.

Once I get it all sorted, I will likely do the same to the other eNMEy I have from the POP build. I believe this cart screenshot should serve as a sufficient BOM. I'm opting for all quick connect fittings so separating the body from the trigger frame is a little easier. You can sub those out for barb fittings if you prefer. Note, the 1/8 OD hose isn't in this list as I'm using the autococker hosing.

[tyronejk]

I've built a few mech ions using just the small diameter hose. I found you don't get shoot-down at the relatively low ROF of mech guns even with the restricted flow.

If you have both hose sizes, it's probably better to use both, but if you have just one, it's still workable.

[Magmoormaster]

I've been curious about that. Obviously it would be much easier/cheaper to use cocker hoses and fittings. It probably wouldn't even be much of an issue at high rates of fire, considering older guns like DMs and Shockers had small air paths running to the noid and dump chamber, they didn't have problems shooting 15+ BPS.

[gnarlynick]

Ya, I was mostly following the original build guide for the mechanized Ions and that called for both the 5/32 and 1/8 OD hose. I believe it was only done that way because the existing fittings for the Ions used those diameters and the SMAV-3 uses 1/16 barbs. I could try and experiment with using all 1/8 OD hose, all it would require is getting a 1/16 tee; I would have enough of the 1/8 quick connect fittings to sub in.

[Emg]

Thank you for this post. I ordered the parts from clippard and got it together the same day. I was able to use the stock trigger with a spacer under the SMAV to keep it as high as possible. I didn’t end up using the QEV since the barb was way too big for the 1/16 tube coming from the SMAV. I like the idea of a push-connect fitting, but it required grinding the first 2 ribs in the trigger frame to fit. I have my SMAV ports facing away from the grip boss so no grinding needed there, the tube does a 180 in its routing to the upper which adds some strain relief during disassembly. Overall it seems to work pretty well trigger pull is definitely snappier and shorter than stock.