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Old 08-27-2014, 02:23 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Nelson(s) differences and compability

Recently I have become more and more interseted in the nelson type pumps that are out there and I was thinking what parts would be interchangable between the different versions out there.

Mostly im looking to find out if different triggerframes can be swapped and if the internals (all from the same marker) will fit into the body (the tube thingy) of another? I understand that some are breechdrop and some boredrop so those two aren't really compatible, but two different boredrops or two different breechdrops?

also, what threads are the old trracers/mavericks? is there any similar threaded barrel than can be rethreaded to trracers/mavericks? do anyone do that? (or would it be easier to rethread the body instead?)
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Old 08-27-2014, 02:43 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Trracers and Mavericks used their own threading. I'm not aware of any other guns that matched it but I'm not saying there aren't any.

Sear and Trigger shape are also important as well as powertube lenght.

There are enough factors involved that it would help to know what you were looking to mix and match.

For instance is it a Trracer with a PT integrated into the hammer?
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:38 PM   #3 (permalink)
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As Greenmtnphantom said, there is a large amount of variability with Nelson designs.

Sear/trigger geometry are extremely important and vary from design to design. You're likely going to have to resort to trial and error or custom fitting to get different parts to work with each other. Lapco parts play well with true Nelspot parts. Basically drop in upgrade.

For trigger frames, I'm not sure how standardized frome hole spacing is. Also you have to consider how the frame screws mount. In all that I'm aware of, the front frame screw goes in from the bottom and threads into the body tube. The rear frame screw comes in two flavors. In the Nelspot/Lapco design, the rear frame screw passes from the top and through the valve and threads into the frame. In the Phantom design, the rear frame screw comes in from the bottom and threads into the valve. The two are not compatible with each other. Likewise, their valves are not compatible.

Power tubes vary in diameter, length, cup seal threads, and design. The Trracer has the power tube integrated with the hammer with a small stub sticking out of the valve. This is incompatible with the standard power tube design used in Nelspots, Phantoms, etc. The Phantom power tube is about the same diameter as the Nelspot power tube, but the Phantom is shorter to accomodate the TPC in the bolt. A Nelspot tube can be cut down to work in the Phantom. The WGP Ranger used a larger diameter power tube and is incompatible.

Anti-kink systems in the bolt/hammer add another level of complexity, typically preventing the mixing and matching of bolts and hammers.


Overall, it's a very complicated problem. A good rule of thumb is that Lapco parts are drop in replacements for Nelspots. Otherwise, it's a case by case basis.


Here are the combinations I use on my various Nelson designs and their compatibility with each other:
Lapco Grey Ghost: All Lapco components, nearly 100% compatible with Nelspot
Nelspot 007: Stock Nelspot body, trigger frame, and valve nut; Lapco Grey Ghost bolt, hammer, power tube, cup seal; random back bottle valve/ASA. Nearlly 100% compatible with Grey Ghost
Avratech Retro 7: Nelson compatible body, trigger frame, and valve; Phantom hammer and sear, Avratech custom bolt to fit Phantom hammer, Lapco power tube cut down to Phantom length, Lapco cup seal.

Last edited by Jackson; 08-27-2014 at 03:45 PM.
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Old 08-27-2014, 04:33 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Old 08-29-2014, 12:37 AM   #5 (permalink)
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As mentioned, it is a case by case thing. Although they are all extremely similar, they are typically not similar enough.

The exception, as Jackson mentioned is the guns that stuck with original Nelson 007 compatibility.
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Old 08-29-2014, 02:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Line SI kept with proper 007 compatibility. Gripframes and ASAs work. This Nelly has WGP guts in it too.
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Old 08-29-2014, 02:59 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleeds View Post
Line SI kept with proper 007 compatibility. Gripframes and ASAs work. This Nelly has WGP guts in it too.
https://i.imgur.com/LRlzduO.jpg
Some, maybe not all WGP (Rangers?) had a different cup seal design so you would need the valve nut and in order to use the cup and cup seal.

There are two different thread patterns that were used for valve nuts depending on what Nelson clone you are talking about as well as at least two different threadings for powertubes.

There are all kinds of minor things like that that make a big difference.

You can take an entire set of CCI internals and drop it into a Nelspot EXCEPT, you need to remove the nylon setscrew or thread the pumprod whole so that you can attach the bolt for the pump handle and you need to take the sear off the hammer and use the original from the Nelspot...

All kinds of almosts. Lots of trial and error, or ask someone who already tried matching two specific parts.
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Originally Posted by Robertsr View Post
I don't so much make money, as provide a conduit for it's movement.
Mega Z for sale: http://www.mcarterbrown.com/forums/m...el-mega-z.html
Stock class = 12grams and a stick feed. End discussion.
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Old 08-29-2014, 03:05 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I should have mentioned it's got a Lapco powertube, Line SI valve nut and a modded NW Black Magic cupseal in there. Definitely a parts build mutt. Hoping to get a full WGP valvetrain soon to see how it compares to the others I have.
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Old 08-29-2014, 05:58 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I have combined Lapco #6 Power Tubes and Lapco Cupseals inside of Phantoms. I have also combined my '08 Lapco Grey Ghost with Line SI Bushmaster quick changer because both are Nelson compatible. In the Duckslide I did it had Phantom parts, Lapco parts and a old Trracer BBA in it.

example of my '08 Grey Ghost and Line SI Bushmaster swap :


'08 Grey Ghost Valve and Line SI Bushmaster Quick Changer :


example of the Duckslide I did with the Trracer BBA ( Lapco and Phantom Guts, only Duckslide to ever use a Trracer BBA ) :



I guess I like being a mad scientist when it comes to Nelson Style Markers...
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Old 09-03-2014, 07:08 PM   #10 (permalink)
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thanks for the information, it seems it was how i feared. The plan was to make a custom body/triggerframe based off measurements from my trracer for a new project, but as i dont know what nelson i will get my hands on i will perhaps have to procure that first then.

also, I would like to get A5 threads on my current maverick..

but, again, thanks for all the info.
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