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Old 06-23-2013, 11:51 PM   #1 (permalink)
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terrible efficency

so today i shot my phantom in the backyard before i go out on the field next weekend since i usually work most weekends. I counted exactly 16 shots per C02 gram until i noticed drop off with my own two eyes. Am im doing something wrong? and how can i get my efficiency up more? please help!
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Old 06-24-2013, 03:20 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Check to see if your powertube is not screwed into the cup seal. They often come loose and cause severe dropoff and low velocity
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Old 06-24-2013, 10:50 AM   #3 (permalink)
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We need more details about the gun, temperature, chrono readings, etc, etc, etc. to narrow down the problem and give accurate advice.

While there are many variables that effect efficiency in a Phantom, paint size vs. barrel bore is almost always the primary cause for inconsistent/poor efficiency. If you can roll a pellet out of your barrel, then it's safe to say you won't be getting 20 usable shots per 12-gram - which is the minimum you should get. Obtaining a tight bore match using aftermarket one-piece barrels or inserts will make all the difference in the world in both accuracy and efficiency, provided you have decent (fresh, round, and undimpled) paint.
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Old 06-24-2013, 11:28 AM   #4 (permalink)
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80 degrees out , sunny, with some humidity, rotated paint that is 3 weeks old and stock phantom barrel. chorno was around 275-295 ball park. the internals are polished tho (came like that when i got the gun)
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Old 06-24-2013, 05:20 PM   #5 (permalink)
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You left out an important detail... what size paint are you shooting? The stock Phantom barrel varies in size depending on manufacture date, but all of them run large comparatively speaking. The older the barrel, the bigger the bore.

Remove the barrel and load a pellet into the breach end of it. Now point the barrel tip towards a bright light source (not the sun!). It you can see light getting past the pellet, or if the pellet just rolls out of the barrel completely, then there is your problem.

If you need to force the pellet into the barrel, and can't see any light, then you have a nice bore match and need to check other things like if your cup seal assembly has come loose, or if your power tube has snapped off at the base. Also check to see if you are missing the nylon TPC lock down nut in your bolt, or if your TPC has backed out of the bolt threads. What kind of springs are you running - stock (silver), or colored (red or blue)? What kind of 12-grams are you using (yes, it can make a difference)? Are you holding your pump handle all the way forward while you shoot? If not, that can make a difference too.

As I mentioned before, there are lots of variables.
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Last edited by Slim; 06-24-2013 at 10:27 PM.
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Old 06-25-2013, 02:11 AM   #6 (permalink)
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it definitely rolls out but i try to shoot on an upward angel to it get the full potential shot out. its an old Urban Camo Tiger Stripe VSC. i just got my barrel back from SSC and have a .684 sleeve to try tomorrow. i went over the whole gun like you suggested. i didnt notice anything out of wack. Still using stock internals and stock (silver) spring. I am using Lelands Co2 grams from Titus (celaniPB). And holding my pump handle forward as usual.
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Old 06-25-2013, 08:38 AM   #7 (permalink)
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When it comes to efficiency the problem with not having the barrel and paint matching isn't roll outs it's air blowing by the ball instead of pushing it.

16 shots in NJ in June is way under what I would expect from a Phantom.

Check bore match and springs, if the phantom is really that old replace the springs and cupseal. It can't hurt.
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I don't so much make money, as provide a conduit for it's movement.
Stock class = 12grams and a stick feed. End discussion.
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Old 06-25-2013, 09:04 AM   #8 (permalink)
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ok sounds good. thank you for the heads up. I was at least expecting around 30-35 shots per c02 gram. is there anything else to do that could raise my efficiency?
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Old 06-25-2013, 09:18 AM   #9 (permalink)
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ok sounds good. thank you for the heads up. I was at least expecting around 30-35 shots per c02 gram. is there anything else to do that could raise my efficiency?
Ive never seen that with my (new) phantom, but then again the barrel is so large for todays paint. :\
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Old 06-25-2013, 09:22 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Current barrels are .685.

Most people I have talked to say the 11" is the most efficient length

Check this out Historic Nelson Tuning Threads
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I don't so much make money, as provide a conduit for it's movement.
Stock class = 12grams and a stick feed. End discussion.
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