Paintball

[djellum]

I think the best way to solve this is to have more classes for tournements. The vapor series speedball tourney i go to locally has 2class's, gravity fed, and whatever fed. Both capped at 10, though some boards only let you go as low as 15 so i suggested raising the cap so were all the same. you can sign up for either, so your gear isnt going to be as much of a limiting factor. you can also cap to different levels depending on the class or have a limited paint supply depending.

Bottom line is someone who pays the money or does the work for a nice expensive setup with all the fixin deserves to have all the goodies they pay for, but should be forced to use those goodies on others with the same. you cant do much with big scenario games since there are so many ppl and you cant get enough refs.

There will be jerks in all classes of course but that just comes with playing a sport. The only unfortunate thing is fields will almost always go with what will make money and newb's will see ppl on tv using ego's and DM's. this means most all tourneys will still fall in the NPPL or similar class where everyone can do what they see on tv and field can sell lots of paint. Guess it doesnt really matter. In the end if the ppl are cool you have fun, but if not it sucks.

[Railgun]

And this is why I often woder about the fallacy of charging so little for field fees and rental gear and then so much for paint.

Split it up a bit better and charge resonable fees for the field and resonable fees for paint and perhaps the refs and owners will tend to monitor the overshooters with a more critical eye? But of course the upfront price for field and gear won't look so attractive.

[gunblaze1]

Raise the prices ? that wont stop overshooting !

All that will do is deter new people from wanting to play and deter other rec players who want to play on a budget.

It obviously wont stop the people that have already blown a load of money on a Marker that shoots 20 BPS and also go through 2 cases of paint or more in a day because their pockets are deep.

All you have to do to stop over shooting is put a limit on how many Balls one can carry in a game.

That would be a good thing for Rec ball ware you have allot of people paying on a budget (<---usually don't have the $700+ markers able to shoot 15-30 BPS) as well as allot of new players coming in.

What is one of the major factors for first timers never coming back ?
I'd have to say overshooting

[JKR]

I personally feel anything over 6-8 bps is too much for mixed recreational play. Sure, if the tourney guys want to mix it up, let 'em.

Cheap electros and insane rates of fire have often led to boring games in my area. The field I play at most has reduced it's field sizes and coupled with the higher rates of fire, movement has become noticeably reduced. Many games for me have lost the thrill of the hunt they used to carry. Now everyone sees everyone and younger guys probably don't even know what flanking means.

Call me an old timer, but I really missed the days before Ions and the like. You will never catch me carrying around an electro - just not my bag. Nothing could have clinched this more than what I witnessed on my last trip to the local field. It rained hard mid-way through the day and we were contemplating playing some speedball in the rain. I chuckled as I watched some of the electro guys wrapping up their guns in plastic bags! Kind of sad, really...

JKR

[Grendel]

It is not just a problem with "electros", I also think a field has the right to disapprove any marker they feel is unsafe, to prevent players from making their trigger too sensitive which can lead to accidental discharges or uncontrolled streams of paint being shot while playing. I do not consider RT triggers as one pull = one paintball either. I have seen people set their RT triggers to unsafe levels and I've even set one for experimenting that was easily in the 20 bps range and I could hold it there. This is just as bad or worse as the markers with SW aids that allow high rates of fire with little effort.

[Horizon]

Originally Posted by Railgun

And this is why I often woder about the fallacy of charging so little for field fees and rental gear and then so much for paint.

Split it up a bit better and charge resonable fees for the field and resonable fees for paint and perhaps the refs and owners will tend to monitor the overshooters with a more critical eye? But of course the upfront price for field and gear won't look so attractive.

So you think that if paint prices were lowered, people would shoot at a slower rate?

Our paint prices here in Canada (at rec. fields) are considerably higher than similar fields in the USA. Guess who has less problems with overshooting and such?

[PhileyOFish]

They can make paintball guns shoot as fast as they want. I believe that overshooting should be seriously looked at. Right now I think it's too loose.

[SnowDawgy]

For me the issue is not bps but the lack of control and safety. Yes we USED to have a 3 hit rule, how many fields actually use this anymore? I have been out playing and was hit by one player with an electro on full auto 30+ times. Field owners are not putting the brakes on these kids either cause for a 2 hr game they are buying and using 2 cases of paint at 80$ a case, why limit their shooting. I think the cap will come when some ppl start getting injured and start suing fields for lack of safety, and that is the problem it will take that to get ppl to change their views. So for me, I stick with the pump club and fart in the general direction of the BPS new age crowd.

[brerlapin]

Originally Posted by Horizon

So you think that if paint prices were lowered, people would shoot at a slower rate?

Our paint prices here in Canada (at rec. fields) are considerably higher than similar fields in the USA. Guess who has less problems with overshooting and such?

Here in Maine, most fields charge about $50-$55 a case for paint for woodball, and I rarely see any problems with overshooting.

I consider overshooting an integral part of speedball, which is why I don't play it. If you want to cut down on it, I think the only reliable method is to limit the amount of paint any one player is allowed to carry on the field to 400 or less. Players can shoot as fast as they want, but I don't think many players will be unloading all of their paint in under a minute, knowing that they'll be useless for the rest of the game. There are too many work arounds for anything else - how do you monitor how many BPS everyone on the field is shooting? Mechanical markers can shoot just as fast as electros, they're just not as appealing to the hosers because they're too "low-tech", but banning electros will just see them getting replaced with full-auto or response trigger mechs, solving nothing.

This might increase the marketability of the game, too, by encouraging more aggressive play. Right now, most of the games I see on TV involve a lot of standing in one spot and ducking behind the same bunkers. Boring as hell, because there's not nearly enough action after the initial flurry of running for cover.

[Railgun]

Originally Posted by gunblaze1

.....All you have to do to stop over shooting is put a limit on how many Balls one can carry in a game......

In the end I think you're right. Some folks just will never care about how much they shoot even if they know the refs are watching. Others don't care because for them money isn't a big deal.

But if you limit the paint then that can change the whole thing in a hurry.

Locally we have a group that plays some of it's games with a "One Hopper" rule. That means one hopper full, no reloading. It was done to help equalize the mech and electro folks so they could all play on a more or less equal footing. You know what? It works. There's a lot more movement and very little spray painting other than very short bursts. Games are typically 15 to 20 minutes long with this group and here and there a guy runs out but when that happens it's just that much more pressure to move more and shoot less.

The same group also plays "Suck It Up" at the end of the day to blow off the last of the paint and air. I've seen some guys come in from that looking like they got hit with a fire hose. Overshooting? YOU BETCHA! But this way the group has something for everyone.