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Old 06-10-2013, 04:31 PM   #151 (permalink)
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So honor is measurable then? An absolute? I'm pretty sure it varies from the perspective of culture and even the individual.

Bounce padding as a tactic for reducing breaks on a hit is cheating plain and simple. If you choose to wear bounce padding to minimize injury then you have an obligation to mitigate it's impact on your opponents, or find yourself shunned. I don't think one ought to overshoot regardless of padding, that is almost as bad as wiping...
In this case I would argue it is. Paintball is a game. The importance of that statement is that each individual who participates in the game choses to participate freely and accepts the rules that are set in place as part of that participation. Playing by the rules that you tacitly agreed to is honorable. While I generally avoid trying to judge other's peoples actions I do not see this massive grey area between honorable and not that many people do.
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Old 06-10-2013, 04:32 PM   #152 (permalink)
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Is there anyway to measurably define what is "too much" padding? For instance, I wear normal Invert pants (everything from the knees to the ankles on the front are padded), Dye forearm/elbow pads, a headwrap, and my unpadded jersey is pretty baggy (since the only way to get arms long enough was to get a size larger than normal). None of this was purchased with the intention of catching bounces; it was purely so I could slide, crawl, dive, and just play more aggressively in general while minimizing pain...as well as keeping dome shots from hurting quite so much.

It appears that some people here would consider something so minimal to be cheating, while others would go even further without a second thought. Where do you draw the line?
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Old 06-10-2013, 04:39 PM   #153 (permalink)
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Once upon a time in the PSP rules IIRC there was a definition of appropriate padding, looseness of clothing and various other things. I do not know if it is still in there or not but the Dye C4 clothing - which became popular in that era - seemed to violate both the intent and wording of the rule. Obviously Dye would disagree with me I assume.

I did not bother to look if there are current rules in regards to this. While I understand that judging intent is impossible I have no intention of playing this game on such a level that this rule is written out and adhered to perfectly. If I believe someone is not playing within the spirit of the rules I simply quit playing and go do something else.
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Old 06-10-2013, 04:49 PM   #154 (permalink)
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From the "like this will ever happen" files:

As long as these vests are made and people buy them, good intentions or not, people will always claim it is for safety. To make it so, and not for the sake of catching bounces, the outer material should be made of a harder plastic. Nothing thick or heavy; just enough to make the surface of the panels hard. Case closed, no more advantage.
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Old 06-10-2013, 04:54 PM   #155 (permalink)
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I bunkered a guy wearing one of those JT vests once. It sounded like a gun shot when the ball hit him. Took me a second to figure out what the heck I'd just heard.
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Old 06-10-2013, 05:12 PM   #156 (permalink)
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Those JT motorcross vests are exactly what I had in mind.
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when you're in the minority what you do gets viewed as what "your people" do.

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Old 06-10-2013, 05:20 PM   #157 (permalink)
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If you choose to wear bounce padding to minimize injury then you have an obligation to mitigate it's impact on your opponents, or find yourself shunned.
This is the exact point I was trying to make. Thanks for wording it nicely.
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Old 06-10-2013, 07:25 PM   #158 (permalink)
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Is there anyway to measurably define what is "too much" padding? For instance, I wear normal Invert pants (everything from the knees to the ankles on the front are padded), Dye forearm/elbow pads, a headwrap, and my unpadded jersey is pretty baggy (since the only way to get arms long enough was to get a size larger than normal). None of this was purchased with the intention of catching bounces; it was purely so I could slide, crawl, dive, and just play more aggressively in general while minimizing pain...as well as keeping dome shots from hurting quite so much.

It appears that some people here would consider something so minimal to be cheating, while others would go even further without a second thought. Where do you draw the line?
the issue isnt if your clothes/gear happen to be bounce prone are you cheating. the question it aimed at intentional padding. i wear a vest, not to cause bounces, or to armor me up so i can ignore hits. if i think i got hit in the vest i put my hands up. it feels cheap otherwise.

my dad has to wear arm pads, a vest and kneepads whenever he plays. because his wife hates him getting all bruised up. once again, not to cause bounces, but for protection.

intentionally wearing clothes to cause a bounce is a scumbag way to play. an intentional bounce due to carefully selected clothing is no different than a wipe. you know damn well when/if youre playing dirty. i know my vest causes bounces, so sometimes i walk off when i could probably play on. it isnt about honor, its about the spirit of the game.

like i said before checking/hoping/wishing/trying for bounces is a good way to get lit up. if i find someone keeps getting bounces ill just start dumping 10 rounds at a time until something breaks. play how you want, but expect your opponent to adjust.
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Old 06-10-2013, 07:34 PM   #159 (permalink)
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If we would all agree to enforce the mankini standard, this thread would be moot.
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Old 06-11-2013, 12:44 AM   #160 (permalink)
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In this case I would argue it is. Paintball is a game. The importance of that statement is that each individual who participates in the game choses to participate freely and accepts the rules that are set in place as part of that participation. Playing by the rules that you tacitly agreed to is honorable. While I generally avoid trying to judge other's peoples actions I do not see this massive grey area between honorable and not that many people do.
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree and apologize for my pedantry in advance. Objective and subjective are binary opposites, they're mutually exclusive perspectives. Morality is subjective and honor is a derivative product of morality so honor is subjective.

Rules for regulating social behaviour are seldom all encompassing. paintball is no exception there are loopholes to exploit. These grey areas are in fact the basis for the OPs question. Rather than try to think up a lexicon of rules for every possible occurrence we tend to craft new rules to prevent the exploits we observe. Some of us try to remedy situations that could be perceived as exploiting voluntarily.

I frequently choose to call myself out if I feel a hit on my padding without a break. It is my prerogative to call myself out for any reason at all, even on a whim. I have no obligation to play on when I'd rather walk off on a bounce. Those who believe I do have some strange notions of accountability, after all I play recreationally.

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This is the exact point I was trying to make. Thanks for wording it nicely.
Your most welcome. It's nice to know I have company in my heresy.
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