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Old 03-09-2013, 09:22 PM   #71 (permalink)
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A good shot is a good shot...

Here is my latest video, some don't break, and some do. At our field all of them count.

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Old 03-09-2013, 09:28 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Nightstar View Post
I'm playing a game for fun rather than a sport to win. I respect an opponent who acknowledges a good shot whether the paint breaks or not. Such a player is worthy of my respect and thus honorable.
Game/sport, whatever. The key is the rules that form the game/sport.

I hate to dig into this, but do you conversely believe that a player that does not call out on a bounce a dishonorable player?


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We are engaged in make-believe gun-fighting.

...

The rules of the game we play vary depending upon participants and dogma. There are other ways of eliminating a player than breaking paint in many games. A barrel tag doesn't break paint. A training knife doesn't break paint. A surrender breaks no paint. I play by the rules of the game but if a player makes a clean shot on me that doesn't break I still call myself out. I hope my opponents see the honor in that but if they don't that's ok too.
And that again highlights the difference between make-believe gun-fighting and a stylized game. That's why we have surrender rules within certain distances. If this were just gunfighting, why would you be required to offer surrender to someone at point blank? Just cap him and move on. Most fields also prohibit player contact, including barrel tags and knives and whatever else you can come up with in this category. People bringing knives to gunfights is one of those make-believe-isms anyways.


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I've wandered pretty far from the OP's question but I think it ties in. A player that uses bounce padding in the hope of exploiting a technicality in the rules is IMHO dishonorable. If the player just want's to avoid bruises I have no objections.
That's what I'm saying -- it's not a technicality in the generally accepted rules. It *is in* the rules.

I personally am fine if someone wants to attempt bounce padding. Just like the fat guy toting a layer of cake on his body, padding has some amount of physical penalty associated with it, probably directly proportional to its effectiveness.
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Old 03-09-2013, 11:19 PM   #73 (permalink)
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In the first game, Lionel Atwill shot Charles Gaines in the leg. It bounced, and Gaines ended up eliminating Atwill. From the very beginning bounces were considered in official rules to be non-hits, and this was a bigger deal in the days of oil based paintball designed not for players, but for hard trees and cow hides. So if going out on a bounce is honorable then call me dishonorable because I am playing until you break paint on me or my gear.

The only "good shot" is one that leaves a quarter-sized blob of paint on the target.
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Old 03-10-2013, 12:30 AM   #74 (permalink)
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I'm not going to try to speak for everyone that calls out on a bounce, BUT
I don't feel honorable when calling out on a bounce. I feel like it's a game and I'll play again. Likewise, I don't think that people that don't leave on a bounce are dishonorable d-bags. It's your personal call to go or stay on a bounce. Like I said before, I've played on after a bounce and I've left after a bounce. It's a game, I play for fun.

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Old 03-10-2013, 03:34 AM   #75 (permalink)
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Game/sport, whatever. The key is the rules that form the game/sport.
No, not whatever. Sport is strictly for the sake of competition. Games are meant to be fun. The incentives are radically different as are the participants and often the rules.

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I hate to dig into this, but do you conversely believe that a player that does not call out on a bounce a dishonorable player?
No I do not. Not doing an honorable thing doesn't make one dishonorable. False dichotomy. Even if I dismiss the fallacy honor is subjective.

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That's what I'm saying -- it's not a technicality in the generally accepted rules. It *is in* the rules.
As I stated earlier "the rules" vary, hence barrel tags, training knives, etc. Regarding bringing a knife to a gunfight, I've gotten eliminations with my training knife...
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Old 03-10-2013, 10:23 AM   #76 (permalink)
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At least some of the times when I call myself out with no breaks, it's out of self-preservation. If you pop me 3-5 times, and none break, 1) you have a wicked angle on me, and 2) you're shooting awful paint that will probably continue to not break. But because of (1), eventually, one of them will. Do I wait the 5-10+ hits for one to break, or leave after 2-3? I'm probably going to leave. I don't think that counts as honorable, more just practical.
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Old 03-10-2013, 11:17 AM   #77 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Diomedes View Post
At least some of the times when I call myself out with no breaks, it's out of self-preservation. If you pop me 3-5 times, and none break, 1) you have a wicked angle on me, and 2) you're shooting awful paint that will probably continue to not break. But because of (1), eventually, one of them will. Do I wait the 5-10+ hits for one to break, or leave after 2-3? I'm probably going to leave. I don't think that counts as honorable, more just practical.
Agreed.

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Old 03-10-2013, 11:30 PM   #78 (permalink)
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Old 03-10-2013, 11:43 PM   #79 (permalink)
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Honestly, I wear a proto chest under armor pad, for extra bounces, and to minimize welts a little... I wear elbow pads for sliding, and yes the extra bounces and for when I crash into stuff... I wear knee pads for protection and the occasional bounce on my knees... I wear speedball pants mainly because they are comfy, I don't need to wear a cup when wearing one, extra knee padding, and they are great with bounces...

I play speedball and woodsball with guys who like to ramp 20-30bps and all I shoot is my S6 or phantom, so that extra padding helps some times but not much really. And I play, if I get hit and it breaks I am out, but if it doesn't I will fight on. I am playing paintball, not air soft. It I want to play with bounces, I will play airsoft. Am I cheating? Not at all, I play honorably, but I know the rules and I know what I can do and can't do.
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Old 03-11-2013, 12:02 AM   #80 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson Death View Post
Do what it takes to win, as long as it's within the rules.
this

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In tourney play - sure. In rec ball I prefer: Do what it takes to have fun, as long as it doesn't come at the expense of other people having fun.
staying in as long as i can within the constraints of the rules is fun...

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Originally Posted by Crimson Death View Post
Do what it takes to win, as long as it's within the rules.
exactly

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Originally Posted by shredxcam View Post
Isn't the point of paintball to make paintball break on each other?
Get shot. Play better next time
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Originally Posted by FreeEnterprise View Post
I often wonder about that very thing. To me the point is to HIT the other player. If the paintball happens to be defective and NOT break, why is the player who made the shot penalized for defective product?
Well none are to blame then. Why should the player who got hit by the poor product have to get out when it's not his fault it didn't break and he is following the rules of the sport?

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If you are playing capture the flag, and you get all the way over to the other teams flag station, and it blew away during the game and is lost forever. Did you win the game?... You got there, and would have pulled it to win, but there was an equipment malfunction. Does that mean the other team will win, because their flag is gone?
Logical Fallacy, you are arguing two very different things to make a point.
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