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-   -   Should FSR Go Mainstream? (http://www.mcarterbrown.com/forums/first-strike/234983-should-fsr-go-mainstream.html)

DSA 06-05-2013 09:00 PM

Should FSR Go Mainstream?
 
FSR has gotten a lot of attention lately and most of it positive, but I foresee a problem with the FSR going mainstream. First of all I don't think it's a good idea to have markers like the DAM shooting FSR's in bonus ball fashion. In my opinion it's not that kind of round. Sure it is capable and I will admit putting rounds down range is a blast, just not so many at once. I honestly see an inherent danger to our sport and our local fields, not to mention the growth of the sport.

Of course my opinion is biased as I advocate a slower paced game helps to grow our sport. I mean really what momma wants to see Jr. show up not only bruised but possibly injured. Yes I said "injured." Not being one to take other peoples word for the sake of agreeing, this week I conducted my own test on FSR and was somewhat dismayed at what I found to be an inferior product when it comes to player safety.

My test was simple. Shoot an FSR at a target and see what happens. What I found was something that I know I will chastised for mentioning and that is the shell can be dangerous in its current state. As you can see in the photograph below, the FSR appears to me not to be as biodegradable as everyone would have you believe. Secondly, the fill is not as water soluble as regular paintball fill. This in it self could cause us public affairs problems by it self. I first noticed this when I shot my neighbors roof across the alley, yep that could cause problems too. That white splot remained on the roof for weeks, even after we had severe thunderstorms, the mark remained. Advocates of FSR might say of course you shot a porous structure and the paint soaked in, but this is simply not the case. What I found is that unlike regular fill which runs clear after a few hours, the FSR fill sticks like paint when allowed to dry. Now I'm now Global Warming green nut but I sure the heck don't want to mark up any forest for years to come for a few moments of pleasure. Will it wash off yes, with a good scrubbing, but when was the last time you saw a group of ballers cleaning off the trees.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/z...43/null-13.jpg

I guess the point I am trying to make is that until Tiberius addresses these issues I really don't believe the FSR should go mainstream. I also believe high ROF markers shouldnt be created or at the very least allowed on fields when the general public is playing paintball for the first time. I for one would not want my son getting lit up by razor sharp shards of FSR shell when he was still in his infancy of paintball, he would have never returned and besides who in their right mind would? As our options grow and specialty rounds become more of the norm I hope each of you as ambassadors to our sport will keep this in mind when playing for fun.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/z...43/null-14.jpg

In my opinion FSR should be limited to Scenario and Big Game play where the big boys play and the stakes are high. Unfortunately I also believe high ROF FSR markers will signal the end to the gentlemens game as we know it. Now don't get me wrong, I love my SR-1 and my FSR's they are the next evolution in the sport of paintball but with every new option comes responsibility.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/z...43/null-15.jpg

Lastly, will manufactures listen to a middle aged paintballer over the possibility of making their next million, probably not, as a matter of fact,no they won't. In the end it's all about making the big bucks despite the cost to the sport itself. Therefore I challenge each and everyone of you to be good ambassadors to this sport and to use FSR in a responsible manner.

DSA-out!

Chappy 06-05-2013 09:10 PM

I have thought that first strikes were a pretty cool idea for quite a while now, and have been interested in trying them out. Couple of weeks go was the first time i played in a rec group where they were used quite a bit and got shot with them. They hurt a bit more but no big deal there. However, when I got home I found a good sized shard in my mask. It made me pause and think. These things are hard and can break into sharp little pieces... I dunno, made me a bit nervous. I could've slit my wrist with it.

Deuce 06-05-2013 09:11 PM

There's already been good long term testing that shows they aren't really biodegradable. To me, that's the biggest hurdle and likely one of the bigger reasons they aren't more accepted by many fields.

I'd like to see that addressed, and then address the issue of getting more fields on board. If we can do that they'll take off exponentially as people realize the potential.

Kmak 06-05-2013 09:23 PM

It is thought provoking, however the biggest hindrances are round price and compatible gun price. Most people are apprehensive enough about paint price.

Axel 06-05-2013 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chappy (Post 2726634)
I have thought that first strikes were a pretty cool idea for quite a while now, and have been interested in trying them out. Couple of weeks go was the first time i played in a rec group where they were used quite a bit and got shot with them. They hurt a bit more but no big deal there. However, when I got home I found a good sized shard in my mask. It made me pause and think. These things are hard and can break into sharp little pieces... I dunno, made me a bit nervous. I could've slit my wrist with it.

That was my first exposure to the first strike also. I took one to the top of the bean first game of the day. The shell fractured and pinched into my hair and that sucker did NOT want to come out. Is it a safety issue...? I dunno... I'm gonna keep playing, anyway.

Also, since when does a DAM qualify for a Pumps & Pistols game??? :p

CCMachinist 06-05-2013 09:42 PM

Well they may be the death of themselves at $350 per 1000

Then I'll turn my SR1 into a 200 yard steel target air rifle.

Or just move to Idaho and make real steel rifles. Jeez we are almost there now.


Yes,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uesuW4BnJs

punisher068 06-05-2013 09:54 PM

Being on the giving(Hammer 7) and recieving end of FS at a recent scenario I can see some of your points are valid
FS definatly leave a more permenant mark then normal paintballs.I attribute it to more solids to compensate for nose weight.Its more like toothpaste then normal PB paint.They do leave a welt and hurt a little more than PBs I felt
I didnt see anyone(there were many) with DAMs,Tiberius or Milsig owners bonus balling anyone,as bps are usually capped at scenarios and public fields I dont see this as a real issue.Seems that some public fields dont allow them also.Its not too cost effective to "spray and pray" with FS rounds and feel most FS users are more into the long range sniperish shots with them
I usually play outlaw\private games where ramping,FS,and almost anything agreed on as safe can be used.These are usually guys I play with regularly and we police ourselves,anyone really bonus balling on purpose runs the risk of being banned,nobody likes a bully
Biodegradeable is a term thrown around lightly with any products.Even Uranium has a shelf life.I can see this being the worst issue for FS,but the volume of rounds shot is a small percentage,PBs can take along time to biodegrade also
Dangerous?Any flying projectile is dangerous.More than PBs,I would say yes to a degree.We have all been cut by shell particles at some point,at least theyre not Monsterballs.
Mainstream?After seeing the amount of players at the scenario with FS guns Id say theyre here to stay,like it or not.Cost will deter a few people but once youve seen them in action it will tempt many to try them.
Answer to your pole,Yes ,but I dont see you as full of it.A good discussion to have and youve got very valid points

uv_halo 06-05-2013 10:28 PM

My number 1 reason I don't think they should go mainstream:

It'll be the same ol' game of paintball (snapshooting, accuracy by volume, etc) over a longer distance.

As for the environment: The paint and gelatin from regular balls doesn't exactly work wonders on trees either. I suspect that the residue left on surfaces by regular paintballs (i.e. on stop signs) is the same as left by FS rounds, there's just more of it (to up the density).

Kmak 06-06-2013 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uv_halo (Post 2726709)
My number 1 reason I don't think they should go mainstream:

It'll be the same ol' game of paintball (snapshooting, accuracy by volume, etc) over a longer distance.

As for the environment: The paint and gelatin from regular balls doesn't exactly work wonders on trees either. I suspect that the residue left on surfaces by regular paintballs (i.e. on stop signs) is the same as left by FS rounds, there's just more of it (to up the density).

I do not think they will ever replace normal paintballs, in terms of close range. There will always be a market for close quarter games. Fsrs will not provide virtually any advantage under 50 ft and barely any at 100. In fact they will never be a 10bps >3 second round, due to mag limitations. Not including a box mag for fsrs, but fields will likely not allow a fsr filled box mag. In terms of consistent rapid fire, hoppers have fsrs beat. I am OK with this, oblong rounds should be used for long range shots and have a minimum engagement distance of 100 feet. My .02

Nightstar 06-06-2013 05:26 PM

FSR don't seem to be very biodegradable, I agree this is a problem. I don't think it's as much of a problem as lead birdshot over the resevoir or live-fire machinegun excercises on lake Ontario. These things happen all the time...

Regarding the gentlemanly game of paintball, that hasn't existed since 1989. Spraying is spraying regardless of the ammo type. If anything the expense of FSR will serve to deter such tactics.

I think FSR have gone mainstream already, that cat is out of the bag.


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