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Old 10-22-2010, 10:19 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Surge-NS View Post
Dye seems to be having the same denial as the rest of paintball about where it's largest market is.
I think the only company that gets that right is Tippmann.
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Old 10-22-2010, 10:29 AM   #32 (permalink)
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I think the only company that gets that right is Tippmann.
Agreed 100%. Tippmann seems to be the only company who understands that focusing on that market without feeling a need to also sell your goods and guns to every competitive tourney player out there is OK. Their business record speaks for itself.

I don't shoot them anymore really, since I've moved on to pumps and electros that suit me better for my style of play, but I respect them immensely for their robust nature and, at the entry level, for how many new players have been able to pick up their marker and have a good time, in contrast to other brands that cheap out with that market.
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Old 10-22-2010, 10:41 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Surge-NS View Post
Seems like it. I wish they would attempt to do something more substantial though. They're one of the only companies who still has the R&D budget.

There's this perceived notion in .........
........Dye seems to be having the same denial as the rest of paintball about where it's largest market is.
Well put sir.
It seems that the only good quality companies concentrated on anything to do with scenario ballers are the MILSIM companies. Now dont get me wrong they make great stuff. But i honestly wish there was a company out there that would make a 4+3 pack that could hold up in the woods. Or like you stated a durable pair of pants that were not "BDU" style, but speedball style. except camo. FULL CLIP USA makes some GREAT products and i endorse all of their stuff but i hate wearing a full vest rig all the time, so im stuck to the typical "speedball" pack when i hit the woods and they have not fared well in my experiences.
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:06 AM   #34 (permalink)
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I wish Dye would remember not all players are tournament player sized.
It would be cool to see some 4x or larger sizes.
My team has Dye Jersey's (I use Dye pants as well) and our back man has got to be 6' tall and at least a good 300#, I believe his jersey is an XXXL, and he still has room to breath. I'm 6' 220# and I wear a very baggy XXL.
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:09 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Why does stuff primarily geared toward the rec player, (because I'm assuming the vast majority of paintball player don't play UWL TTPL or SPPL any more than those who play PSP or NPPL) not reflect the needs and desires of the rec player?... The rec market just ends up being a series of products that are simply par, because the industry doesn't respect the rec player's capability to estimate quality. The result? Rec players see that the equipment is lesser quality, and wear tourney stuff.
I think an unstated issue here is that companies in general don't cater to the rec market because the needs of recreational players are much more diverse and undefined. The tournament paintball situation is very standardized, so it's relatively easy to anticipate the needs of the players. On the other hand, it's very difficult to tell what "rec" even means.
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:31 AM   #36 (permalink)
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I think an unstated issue here is that companies in general don't cater to the rec market because the needs of recreational players are much more diverse and undefined. The tournament paintball situation is very standardized, so it's relatively easy to anticipate the needs of the players. On the other hand, it's very difficult to tell what "rec" even means.
You know this IS a valid point. And its not just rec-ballers either. Even among scenario teams, any given group or even any given player on a team will not necessarily want the same thing from their gear. You'll have guys who want stuff to be light and breathable for their fast, in-your-face type of play, and other guys who want to be able to roll an M1 Abrams over their gear without worry, without any concern for weight.

I mean just looking around the NE scenario scene, at some of the bigger teams out there, you have guys like the NY Assassins or the 13th Legionnaires who run as essentially "speedballers in the woods", and you have guys like TSSOC or the Red Raiders who are pretty much the polar opposite as far as gear selection, favoring BDU's and more military-esque tactics.

I think its those of us in the middle of those extremes that are the most dissatisfied with the current offerings, but if I have to be honest I have no clue just how big that group is...
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:49 AM   #37 (permalink)
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I think its those of us in the middle of those extremes that are the most dissatisfied with the current offerings, but if I have to be honest I have no clue just how big that group is...
that would be our guys as well
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Old 10-22-2010, 12:09 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Couple things here.

Dye does a lot of things right. Masks, hoppers, pads, and pants are all right (and guns but thats not relevant here). The jerseys look better this year, last year they were too heavy.

This new tac line looks like they're allowing people to build out vests as they need. They look like they are a lightweight base and the pod holders and such are removable?

I see a lot of people looking at the price, this is first generation stuff but they aren't a valken trying to lowball the market (or BT and Tippman trying to remain close to Valken pricing--from a shop manager's side, we saw the prices of BT and Tippman soft goods drop when Valken hit the Scenario market). It looks like the quality is as high as their tournament line...which is nice to see because BT and Valken tac stuff seems like an after thought when compared to Empire and Valken tournament lines.

If anyone hasn't had the opportunity to work with dye equipment before, it's built like a brick sh*thouse. I think this is definitely a step in the right direction for a top manufacturer to acknowledge that speedball is not the only form of paintball.

But, anyone who knows me knows I'm a Dye Fanboy...so you can take this how you will, but I am at the field every single saturday and sunday for years and I'm a fanboy because they do things better than anyone else. I saw one broken rotor (user error--hosed off the electronics), no broken I4s, and very few ripped softgoods...other companies on the other hand, I cannot say the same.
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Old 10-22-2010, 01:14 PM   #39 (permalink)
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I'm a fanboy for Dye, but only for headbands and guns, although i've only ever bought used dye guns (yay for never breaking the $200 mark!), which doesn't support them at all, lol!

I like their diversity (as late as it is). They do make quality products, or at least their guns have always served me well and i've never heard bad things about anything else (quality of the I4 is fantastic, albeit it doesn't fit everyone's head, including mine).

I think the problem here is consultation - they've only got speedballers providing input, the rest i think is just research they're doing without seeking advice. But as Inflicted said, who could they consult? They can't ask each and every one of us. So i can respect their effort, at least.

May also be worth pointing out that i'm very disappointed with their 2011 speedball offerings - absolutely nothing new aside from new annos for the NT.
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Old 10-22-2010, 01:40 PM   #40 (permalink)
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i dont think their speedball website has been updated yet.
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