Should I get a regulator?

Gabe · 12-18-2008, 06:14 PM

Hey guys, quick question about gun efficiency. I'm getting about 30-some shots per oz right now, how much efficiency gain would I see running a PPS stab to regulate and keep liquid out? Also, since the gun runs off a back bottle ASA and I think the hose keeps a decent bit of liquid out would I see a change?

souz4402 · 12-18-2008, 06:28 PM

you will probably see an increase if the marker isnt designed to run on liquid...also you could tune your operating pressure to match the valve/hammer spring combination. There isnt much to lose by adding a regulator to an un-regulated system.

HP_Lovecraft · 12-19-2008, 10:26 AM

The liquid has nothing to do with effeciency. So a reg will not improve that.

However, an E/C will greatly improve effeciency. The problem with the VM is the valve space is extremely small. So what happens is the gun literally starves with each shot, and to compensate, a larger volume of gas has to be pushed through the valve.

So adding a simple E/C can almost double your shots per oz. Just pick up a simple one off ebay, add to the front, then run a line to your backbottle. You might need a new line that is a couple inches longer.

Anonymous Coward · 12-19-2008, 11:05 AM

I recommend the TASO expansion chamber. I checked eBay and I can't find one. They pop up from time to time from I&I Sports. Besides it's massive air chamber you can swivel the input port to your liking. The chamber is two pieces. The inner core and the outer shell that. The outer shell you can move and adjust to your liking.

Greenmtnphantom · 12-19-2008, 11:09 AM

I don't know if it would fit on a VM or not but ACI made some damned fine EC's (my oppinion) and they are still available in various sizes and colors all over ebay.

souz4402 · 12-19-2008, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HP_Lovecraft

The liquid has nothing to do with effeciency. So a reg will not improve that.

However, an E/C will greatly improve effeciency...

So liquid has nothing to do with efficiency but by using an E/C to prevent liquid from entering the marker it will improve efficiency? yeah.......

If the marker isnt designed to run on liquid and the marker is indeed pulling up liquid into the valve chamber then obviously the marker isnt tuned properly and hence will not be in its most efficient configuration.

Anonymous Coward · 12-19-2008, 01:29 PM

The VM can run on pure CO2 liquid at low temps with no problems. Minus the F4 Illustrator, I don't know of another paintball gun that could with ease.

I use a reg, but that's because I play in high temps. And since I don't use the standard bolt, I need to adjust the velocity with the reg and not with the bolt screw.

HP_Lovecraft · 12-19-2008, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by souz4402

So liquid has nothing to do with efficiency but by using an E/C to prevent liquid from entering the marker it will improve efficiency? yeah.......
.

It is a common misconception that the purpose of an E/C is to prevent liquid.
It is not. It has nothing to do with liquid.

The "Expansion" in the title refers to thermal expansion. In short, it adds surface area to the downstream flow, which minimizes the the ambient heat loss during normal fire/boil cycles. The thermal expansion rates for a VM are absolutely terrible for a variety of factors.

Thats why good E/Cs have internal "fins" like a radiator, except it is doing the reverse of a radiator. (absorbng heat, rather then getting rid of it).

Plus, the E/C will also act as a "volumizer", or "LPC". This also adds to the effeciency for the previously mentioned dwell issues.

Again, DO NOT FEAR the liquid. People like to blame gun problems on liquid co2, but 95% of the time, it has nothing to do with it.

A well built E/C will double the shots on a VM. Well, early VMs. Later versions actually have an internal E/C factory built.

HurtCow · 12-19-2008, 04:14 PM

Do you have an anti-syphon in your tank?

VM-onster · 12-19-2008, 04:35 PM

I run, i think its the air america Violater on my VM rifle and has done a lot for it...

12-18-2008, 06:14 PM	#1 (permalink)
Gabe Post Whore Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Chugiak, AK	Should I get a regulator? Hey guys, quick question about gun efficiency. I'm getting about 30-some shots per oz right now, how much efficiency gain would I see running a PPS stab to regulate and keep liquid out? Also, since the gun runs off a back bottle ASA and I think the hose keeps a decent bit of liquid out would I see a change? __________________ "There's nary a beast that can outrun a greased-up scotsman!" - Willie "What makes a VM so charming is that you can chop down small trees with it" - Jaan

12-18-2008, 06:28 PM	#2 (permalink)
souz4402 Corp Por, Kal Vas Flam Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Spokane, WA	you will probably see an increase if the marker isnt designed to run on liquid...also you could tune your operating pressure to match the valve/hammer spring combination. There isnt much to lose by adding a regulator to an un-regulated system. __________________ My Feedback

12-19-2008, 10:26 AM	#3 (permalink)
HP_Lovecraft Post Whore Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Southern Maine	The liquid has nothing to do with effeciency. So a reg will not improve that. However, an E/C will greatly improve effeciency. The problem with the VM is the valve space is extremely small. So what happens is the gun literally starves with each shot, and to compensate, a larger volume of gas has to be pushed through the valve. So adding a simple E/C can almost double your shots per oz. Just pick up a simple one off ebay, add to the front, then run a line to your backbottle. You might need a new line that is a couple inches longer. __________________ www.montneel.com "the evidence strongly suggests that neither Billy nor Adam (Smart Parts) could have invented the electronic paintgun" -Garr M. King, U.S. Judge

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12-19-2008, 11:05 AM	#4 (permalink)
Anonymous Coward Active Member Join Date: Jul 2007	I recommend the TASO expansion chamber. I checked eBay and I can't find one. They pop up from time to time from I&I Sports. Besides it's massive air chamber you can swivel the input port to your liking. The chamber is two pieces. The inner core and the outer shell that. The outer shell you can move and adjust to your liking.

12-19-2008, 01:29 PM	#7 (permalink)
Anonymous Coward Active Member Join Date: Jul 2007	The VM can run on pure CO2 liquid at low temps with no problems. Minus the F4 Illustrator, I don't know of another paintball gun that could with ease. I use a reg, but that's because I play in high temps. And since I don't use the standard bolt, I need to adjust the velocity with the reg and not with the bolt screw.

12-19-2008, 04:35 PM	#10 (permalink)
VM-onster Seasoned Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: WestCoast	I run, i think its the air america Violater on my VM rifle and has done a lot for it...